Ryan Manning

[Bad Wolf]

4 hours ago, ally_uk said:

Think he is utter shite I'd recall Perraud.... 

Hardly an upgrade. They're both just awful.

[Fabrice29]

1 hour ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

I agree that the board loves someome to blame, but when you've got the more rational posters saying he is shit, normally that should tell you something.

He's not shit though. He won player of the season at a mid table team in this league and I think he'd get into a lot of teams at this level, including ours obviously. We're in the Championship remember, he's a decent player at this level and is delivering both performances and the stats of someone of that level. KWP on the other side is a luxury so maybe people are feeling entitled to see that level of performance. Even if he's our worst player (a cringeworthy phrase and discussion), he's still quite clearly capable at this level and the stick he's getting here is unwarranted when you add context to it. 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

13 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

He won player of the season at a mid table team in this league and I think he'd get into a lot of teams at this level,

But isn't that kind of the point though? He's not playing for a mid table team in the Championship, he's playing for a team that is challenging for automatic promotion. I expected a lot more from him when he signed, considering we supposedly beat Leeds to sign him. He's average at best.

[Fabrice29]

6 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

But isn't that kind of the point though? He's not playing for a mid table team in the Championship, he's playing for a team that is challenging for automatic promotion. I expected a lot more from him when he signed, considering we supposedly beat Leeds to sign him. He's average at best.

I'd bet you he's above average in this league by any metric you named and justifying his place in an above average team in said league. Except for "impressing the odd bloke on Saintsweb".

Edited February 22 by Fabrice29

[Harry_SFC]

4 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

I'd bet you he's above average in this league by any metric you named and justifying his place in an above average team in said league. Except for "impressing the odd bloke on Saintsweb".

Fair play for trying but you're not changing my mind. Couldn't care less what he did for Swansea, from what he's shown at Saints he just isn't good enough for us. 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

8 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

I'd bet you he's above average in this league by any metric you named and justifying his place in an above average team in said league. Except for "impressing the odd bloke on Saintsweb".

I'd question whether we are above average to be honest. 

[VectisSaint]

4 hours ago, Wade Garrett said:

I have to disagree about Meghoma being ready.  His wingers have got the better of him too often for my liking.

 

What, you mean like Manning

 

But not as often.

[Fabrice29]

3 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

I'd question whether we are above average to be honest. 

We're 4th and lost 2 games in 25 or something. Okay.

[S-Clarke]

1 hour ago, Fabrice29 said:

He's not shit though. He won player of the season at a mid table team in this league and I think he'd get into a lot of teams at this level, including ours obviously. We're in the Championship remember, he's a decent player at this level and is delivering both performances and the stats of someone of that level. KWP on the other side is a luxury so maybe people are feeling entitled to see that level of performance. Even if he's our worst player (a cringeworthy phrase and discussion), he's still quite clearly capable at this level and the stick he's getting here is unwarranted when you add context to it. 

He won play of the season last season, yep. (on Sky Sports, not the official one). But who cares what he did last season? All we can judge him on is what we see in front of us, and it's been pretty pitiful let's be honest.

I don't need to look at stats, graphs and figures to know that he hasn't scored, maybe assisted 1 at best and has created very little. On the other hand he's created a shit load of opportunities for the opposition through his awful touch, poor positioning and lack of awareness on transition. That doesn't strike me as someone who has been decent for us and I don't think it's fair to say our expectations are too high. I just want someone who can defend and provide an outlet at full back. 

[Whitey Grandad]

I may be going out on a limb here but…

…I don’t think he’s going to be Player of this Season.

[Fabrice29]

9 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

He won play of the season last season, yep. (on Sky Sports, not the official one). But who cares what he did last season? All we can judge him on is what we see in front of us, and it's been pretty pitiful let's be honest.

I don't need to look at stats, graphs and figures to know that he hasn't scored, maybe assisted 1 at best and has created very little. On the other hand he's created a shit load of opportunities for the opposition through his awful touch, poor positioning and lack of awareness on transition. That doesn't strike me as someone who has been decent for us and I don't think it's fair to say our expectations are too high. I just want someone who can defend and provide an outlet at full back. 

Well it's two assists which is the same as KWP and it's the most key passes in the squad per game except for JWP. But you keep not looking at the stats and stating things that aren't true. 

[Fabrice29]

3 minutes ago, Whitey Grandad said:

I may be going out on a limb here but…

…I don’t think he’s going to be Player of this Season.

Nobody who is defending him is saying he will be. I'm not even saying he's particularly great but the idea he's been shit just simply isn't true, he's a decent Championship left back, which is useful because that's the level we are at.

[Whitey Grandad]

3 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Well it's two assists which is the same as KWP and it's the most key passes in the squad per game except for JWP. But you keep not looking at the stats and stating things that aren't true. 

Stats are meaningless. As he has proved.

Call me old fashioned but I prefer my full backs to defend first and attack second.

[Whitey Grandad]

1 minute ago, Fabrice29 said:

Nobody who is defending him is saying he will be. I'm not even saying he's particularly great but the idea he's been shit just simply isn't true, he's a decent Championship left back, which is useful because that's the level we are at.

A mid table team possibly, but we need more than that.

[S-Clarke]

3 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Nobody who is defending him is saying he will be. I'm not even saying he's particularly great but the idea he's been shit just simply isn't true, he's a decent Championship left back, which is useful because that's the level we are at.

Sorry, I'll just keep watching the game in front of me. I know what I can see.

[Fabrice29]

4 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

Sorry, I'll just keep watching the game in front of me. I know what I can see.

Well you've missed an assist and a shed load of chances being created so yeah, keep trusting your eyes.

[Whitey Grandad]

Just now, Fabrice29 said:

Well you've missed an assist and a shed load of chances being created so yeah, keep trusting your eyes.

‘an assist’?  Wow

I know what I saw on Tuesday and I saw him getting regularly skinned and caught out of position all night long.

[egg]

20 minutes ago, Fabrice29 said:

Well it's two assists which is the same as KWP and it's the most key passes in the squad per game except for JWP. But you keep not looking at the stats and stating things that aren't true. 

Where do I find the stats for not getting tight to his man, not being strong in the tackle, and being out of position? Focusing on the attacking stats is a bit pointless when first and foremost he has to defend, but doesn't do it well. 

Edited February 22 by egg

[Fabrice29]

1 minute ago, egg said:

Where do I find the stats for not getting tight to his man, not being strong in the tackle, and being out of position? Focusing on the attacking stats is a bit pointless when first and foremost he has to defend, but doesn't do it well. 

Well it's just the ones that he bought up so that's why I mentioned them. Whoscored.com if you do want to check out his tackle numbers btw. 

[Lee On Solent Saint]

2 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

We're 4th and lost 2 games in 25 or something. Okay.

Wouldn't that class as good? You don't think we are a good team for the level we are at?

[Andrew Watson]

He is very poor defensively,which is the main attribute a full back needs. Martins intransigence to keep playing him and one or two others has probably cost us a top 2 finish. Losing 2 of our last 3 games to one average and one good side has undone a lot of the unbeaten run. We had to lose some time,but not to those clubs.

[Galway saint]

the reason he’s out of position so often trailing behind whoever is running scott fee down the wing is possibly because he’s got no positional sense but it could also be that he ends up out a limb and looks shit because those are the positions he is told to take by the manager. he’s being asked to play like cafu whereas he’s just a skinny lad from the west of ireland. he was born in galway so i have to stick up for him 

[Whitey Grandad]

42 minutes ago, Galway saint said:

the reason he’s out of position so often trailing behind whoever is running scott fee down the wing is possibly because he’s got no positional sense but it could also be that he ends up out a limb and looks shit because those are the positions he is told to take by the manager. he’s being asked to play like cafu whereas he’s just a skinny lad from the west of ireland. he was born in galway so i have to stick up for him 

There was one occasion when he was in the correct position but their winger just made a feint and skipped past him into our penalty area as if he wasn’t there.

[HKsaint]

3 hours ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

I'd question whether we are above average to be honest. 

We were not above average when he was playing, tbh.

[StrangelyBrown]

2 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

Well it's just the ones that he bought up so that's why I mentioned them. Whoscored.com if you do want to check out his tackle numbers btw. 

Whoscored.com underlines everything that is wrong with a stats based view. Just compare Smallbone and Downes... Smallbone apparently is the better player according to the stats. Eyes and a simple grasp of the game will tell you otherwise.

Anyone who has studied stats knows that you can use stats to prove almost anything you like - the interpretation of the data is the important thing not the data 

[Saint Fan CaM]

For a player that is in the team because he’s great at Russball, he is positionally inept often getting caught out forward. Less so nowadays, but early in the season he often got caught wandering around trying to be the lauded inverted FB or whatever it was called (he was shit at that too). Putting all this together he unbalances the defence in my opinion and as such is a liability. At best, you could argue he’s just not suited to the system RM is now expecting of the team - Russball has moved on since Swansea…Manning hasn’t.

[Wade Garrett]

9 hours ago, VectisSaint said:

What, you mean like Manning

 

But not as often.

Exactly like that.  Manning has to be dropped regardless.

[Saint_clark]

6 hours ago, StrangelyBrown said:

Whoscored.com underlines everything that is wrong with a stats based view. Just compare Smallbone and Downes... Smallbone apparently is the better player according to the stats. Eyes and a simple grasp of the game will tell you otherwise.

Anyone who has studied stats knows that you can use stats to prove almost anything you like - the interpretation of the data is the important thing not the data 

I'm not sure what you're looking at, Whoscored has Downes at a 6.97 average rating across the season, Smallbone at a 6.72. Only Arma and KWP have a higher rating than Downes (apart from Tella and JWP but not including them for obvious reasons). 

[S-Clarke]

13 hours ago, Fabrice29 said:

Well you've missed an assist and a shed load of chances being created so yeah, keep trusting your eyes.

Not too hard to miss a single assist tbf. What are the shed load of chances by the way? do you know what games they were in?

[John Boy Saint]

11 hours ago, Whitey Grandad said:

There was one occasion when he was in the correct position but their winger just made a feint and skipped past him into our penalty area as if he wasn’t there.

With this in mind, my observation, albeit from the comfort of my armchair. On many occasions when face to face with an opponent player, the opponent makes to knock the ball past him, succeeds, and Manning seems to turn the wrong way, away from the travel of the ball, to try and snuff out the danger, but having gone the long way around to re engage, the oppo player has been given that micro second he needs to whip the ball into the box. 
 

[ErwinK1961]

This does all feel a bit OTT.

He’s not great, but don’t think the tactics and/or lack of cover he has in front him of him when Fraser doesn’t play isn’t helping.

Let’s also not forget that we’re not exactly blessed with options at LB. Bree has been out injured for a while, not sure Larios even exists anymore. Stephens did well against West Brom, but people have also previously moaned when he’s been “shoe-horned” into the team. Could play KWP there, but then you weaken both sides of the pitch rather than just one. Meghoma has done well in cups games that no-one’s too bothered about, different ask doing it for a promotion chasing team at 17.

And RM has been very happy to drop him out the side before, so this ‘mate’ stuff is a bit boring.

 

[VectisSaint]

On 22/02/2024 at 16:13, Fabrice29 said:

Bale aside they all played for us in the PL. Comparing him to PL standard players feels a bit harsh, especially when we’ve yet to play him at that level. The idea that he should be compared to and judge to the standard of some of our best ever full backs and some world class ones at that is genuinely mad, no wonder the lad is criticised every week if that’s the level people want. 

Just to say that at no point in my post did I compare Ryan Manning with any of the players listed. Try reading it again. I was merely bemoaning the fact that we have a rich history of good players in that particular position, and it is sad that we have ended up where we are with such a dearth of talent in this particular position.

That said, many of our good left backs did play in the Championship (or equivalent), some even lower (Bale) and some of the best ones who didn't played in their teens in the Premier League, I don't think Shaw or Bale or Bridge suffered too much from playing in their teens as someone else suggested, they seem to have done alright for themselves all things considered. I'm pretty sure Meghoma would not disgrace himself playing in the Championship, he certainly would be a step up on Manning.

[6ft8saint]

Would we all be this negative on him if his shot on goal had gone in on Tuesday. His was what I'd say was one the closest we had of scoring before aribo came on. And it was pretty close to going in???

[Whitey Grandad]

11 minutes ago, 6ft8saint said:

Would we all be this negative on him if his shot on goal had gone in on Tuesday. His was what I'd say was one the closest we had of scoring before aribo came on. And it was pretty close to going in???

Not really. Rothwell’s chance was clearer.

My criticism of him relates to his defensive qualities.

[Baird of the land]

We need a poll, who is the better at defending Ryan Manning or Danny Fox?

[S-Clarke]

I'd have Fox every day, he was decent for us I thought. At least he had an attacking output that season, 11 assists I think? 

If Manning was able to make up for his defensive dodginess with some attacking threat, then he'd have a few more fans - but even in attack he is pretty piss poor tbf. We will be so much more stable with him out of the side. Guarantee it.

[Dman]

He’s clearly playing how he’s been told, or he wouldn’t be getting picked week in week out. That’s on the manager and not him.

Today, in the absence of KWP, should have been perfect for him to push higher with the RB playing a little more defensively, yet Martin is hell bent on playing a way which doesn’t suit us, not Manning. 
 

there’s clearly a player in there, specifically going forward, we just not making the most of him. 

[Wade Garrett]

As inept a performance today as George Weah’s cousin on his debut.

[The Kraken]

14 minutes ago, S-Clarke said:

I'd have Fox every day, he was decent for us I thought. At least he had an attacking output that season, 11 assists I think? 

If Manning was able to make up for his defensive dodginess with some attacking threat, then he'd have a few more fans - but even in attack he is pretty piss poor tbf. We will be so much more stable with him out of the side. Guarantee it.

Breezy left back KWP right back please. It’s about the most solid we looked all season when we did that.

[saintant]

Tries hard but is well out of his depth. Should be nothing more than a regular sub - just a squad player who should be getting a few minutes here and there off the bench. Time for RM to stop kidding himself that Manning belongs in our first eleven.  

[Harry_SFC]

13 minutes ago, Dman said:

He’s clearly playing how he’s been told, or he wouldn’t be getting picked week in week out. That’s on the manager and not him.

Today, in the absence of KWP, should have been perfect for him to push higher with the RB playing a little more defensively, yet Martin is hell bent on playing a way which doesn’t suit us, not Manning. 
 

there’s clearly a player in there, specifically going forward, we just not making the most of him. 

Sorry mate, I don't agree. He's shite.

[Nordic Saint]

6 minutes ago, saintant said:

Tries hard but is well out of his depth. Should be nothing more than a regular sub - just a squad player who should be getting a few minutes here and there off the bench. Time for RM to stop kidding himself that Manning belongs in our first eleven.  

I'm not sure I'd even bring him on as a sub as he could throw the game away.

[saintant]

2 minutes ago, Nordic Saint said:

I'm not sure I'd even bring him on as a sub as he could throw the game away.

To clarify I was meaning give him a few minutes here and there if we're comfortably winning.

[Galway saint]

26 minutes ago, Dman said:

He’s clearly playing how he’s been told, or he wouldn’t be getting picked week in week out. That’s on the manager and not him.

Today, in the absence of KWP, should have been perfect for him to push higher with the RB playing a little more defensively, yet Martin is hell bent on playing a way which doesn’t suit us, not Manning. 
 

there’s clearly a player in there, specifically going forward, we just not making the most of him. 

I think there is a lot in this - he’s not great positionally and should not be in the first X1 but I think some of his shortcomings are a product of how he’s asked to play and a failure off RM to recognise he’s not cafu. 

Should be KWP, JB, THB and Bree 

[S-Clarke]

The confusing thing with people saying that he's ''playing how he's being told to play'' is that Martin knows him better than any of us, better than any of the players at the club. Martin knows his weaknesses and his limitations. He's got him playing in a way he surely knows he can do, and has seen him do it (albeit in a much lesser team). I just think this is a step too far for Manning in terms of a level, he's a pretty middling Champ player for me.

Edited March 2 by S-Clarke

[stknowle]

I'm sorry but this guy is fucking useless at his job. Alarm bells started ringing with that ridiculous trip over the ball which gave a goal away in the 4-4 against Norwich and they've been ringing ever since. To be fair I don't think he's been as obviously responsible for a goal conceded as that fuck up ever since but equally he's done nothing ever since to convince me he is a halfway competent defender. Nothing against him personally but as a footballer at this level he's fucking awful and a massive weak link in our team. 

[Convict Colony]

Ryan Manning is a overly hairy monster from Fraggle rock who doesnt score goals, hardly assists and defends like the maginot line, out of position and static.

[sfc4prem]

Poor chap. I've said it before, but I don't rate the guy. A clear weak link.

[Saint Garrett]

There is no doubt he is a big weak link in our side, but I just cannot see that it is his fault for defending the middle of the pitch and not getting out to the wide players.  It feels like it's happened all season, and it must be a tactical choice surely? Or there is no way he'd be in the side? He is ok, nothing more, but defensively he is the player who the opposition target and that should say it all really.

[John B]

5 minutes ago, Saint Garrett said:

There is no doubt he is a big weak link in our side, but I just cannot see that it is his fault for defending the middle of the pitch and not getting out to the wide players.  It feels like it's happened all season, and it must be a tactical choice surely? Or there is no way he'd be in the side? He is ok, nothing more, but defensively he is the player who the opposition target and that should say it all really.

What do his stats say according to someone they are better than Bree's