#Spygate

[Jimmy_D]

2 hours ago, Willo of Whiteley said:

One does wonder if the Circle of Trust are privy to any current goings on at the club 👀😉

It’s all Turkish, he’s the spy. That’s how he’s been so ITK about our unbeaten run. That the reason it’s called the Circle of Trust. It’s all so clear now.

[sockeye]

Some of our fans are total virtue signaling wets

[Lee On Solent Saint]

1 minute ago, sockeye said:

Some of our fans are total virtue signaling wets

Fuckin twats

[RedArmy]

50 minutes ago, SaintlyAnd said:

My gut feel based on all that is I can imagine the clubs internal investigation saying this was something done by a couple of analysts and they’ll be disciplined. So not the lone wolf thing, but also not the everyone-complicit thing.

I could see that being true. 
 

I remember Boro fans finding another Saints analyst who had worked for them and also deleted his LinkedIn. Can’t remember his name and fucked if I’m reading through that thread on the mental asylum they call a forum. 
 

Entirely conceivable that he’s the “chief spy”and has sent the intern up to Boro as being an ex employee he would be spotted rather easily and known. 
 

Probably didn't account for just how much of an amateur this young lad turned out to be. 

[Dr. Kucho]

10 minutes ago, Jimmy_D said:

It’s all Turkish, he’s the spy. That’s how he’s been so ITK about our unbeaten run. That the reason it’s called the Circle of Trust. It’s all so clear now.

Shouldn’t it be called the “Circle of Turkish” if it’s all about him? 

[Jimmy_D]

3 minutes ago, sockeye said:

Some of our fans are total virtue signaling wets

Or they just happen to have a PO postcode  

[BotleySaint]

3 minutes ago, sockeye said:

Some of our fans are total virtue signaling wets

Sorry but when I read this I just assumed it was Middlesbrough fans pretending to be Saints fans to keep building the momentum.

No way to prove either way.

[Farmer Saint]

4 minutes ago, sockeye said:

Some of our fans are total virtue signaling wets

Fucking pussies. Let's send Will Salt round to spy on their wives.

[James G]

2 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

Fucking pussies. Let's send Will Salt round to spy on their wives.

We could send Bill Pepper round too, but I wouldn't want to Push It

[grezz]

35 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

"We were watching Middlesbrough"

That's the look, that's the look

The look of Will

That's the look, that's the look

The look of Will

That's the look, that's the look

The look of Willlllll

Heavens above.

 

[trousers]

39 minutes ago, saintant said:

One of the most interesting insights about this I've read so thanks for the content. The overarching take from it seems to be that all clubs have and are doing it and nobody has wanted to or bothered to police it so a blind eye is turned. This begs the question as to why Boro have suddenly decided to take the action they have and I'm not sure of the answer. The only thing that springs to mind is that they saw it as a chance to get us on the back foot in the lead up to this game and create a narrative that they've fueled so that it gathered momentum. Might be well off the mark but if what's posted by SaintlyAnd is true they certainly seem to have gone left field on it but for what reason?

It also begs the question, have Boro themselves been at it and is there any evidence on them?

 

Yep, good points. I'd even go as far as suggesting that @SaintlyAnd puts his ex-analyst friend in touch with the club as it sounds like he has some relevant intel that could be used in our defence 👍🏻

[HarvSFC]

You can just see the fans forum this summer. Instead of questions about the women's team and making St Mary's more welcoming for away fans. We'll get, why didn't we forfeit the Middlesbrough games and give them a bye to the play-off finals?

[Barry the Badger]

I am so baffled by this. 

IF the club sent him for some super secret spying, that cannot possibly be his attempt.

[Saint Fan CaM]

13 hours ago, 64saint said:

Ok, I've come back to chastise you mate.  You most certainly got it wrong. 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Fair play, but as I’ve already explained, it was said in the spirit of reverse psychology…hence the winky emoji. 🤭

[Verbal]

Will Salt's "I was major espionage plotter" story falls apart as actual footage from his iPhone is released.

 

[Cuddles]

7 minutes ago, Verbal said:

Will Salt's "I was major espionage plotter" story falls apart as actual footage from his iPhone is released.

 

Woz this, bitty?

[bpsaint]

1 hour ago, sockeye said:

Some of our fans are total virtue signaling wets

Who are these utter fucking wet lettuces. Fannies.

[31cc]

1 hour ago, sockeye said:

Some of our fans are total virtue signaling wets

There was a post like this on Twitter but after about 2 seconds of sleuthing I found out he was a Leeds fan.

[HarvSFC]

Remember the gamesmanship from Swansea in the build up to the Gabbiadini game in 2018? Were the media and pundits calling them cheats and demanding a forfeit, financial compensation and a points deduction as they did everything in their power to unsettle us and gain an advantage prior to the match starting?

Or did it quickly get brushed over and Mark Hughes said, their tactics motivated us? "We suspected that maybe it was some of the dark arts at work but we didn't let it affect us, in fact we used it as a motivating factor. That helped our focus and we won't be staying in the vicinity of the hotel Marriott Swansea, I think we will stick to the Vale of Glamorgan."

[CSA96]

6 hours ago, Football Special said:

Im confused why Middlesbrough are appointing lawyers in their case against Southampton, they are acting like prosecutors in a court of law rather than just 'reporting the incident to EFL'

https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/nick-de-marco-middlesbrough-hire-33939191?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwdGRjcARxqExjbGNrBHGn2mV4dG4DYWVtAjExAHNydGMGYXBwX2lkDDM1MDY4NTUzMTcyOAABHjTJB4BA2sdHDw-SGNCP12tQ8d-VMi2JQKOsr8UTq1C_ZpeE5_YiO_qxEtQ4_aem_mv4Ad_Vj7UA63Bgo9oBSuw

Throwing absolutely everything at it arent they rather than just trying to beat us on the pitch 

Because Gibson's got an eye on preparing for what comes next. Once he doesn't get the EFL punishment he's stomping his feet for and demanding - Saints to be removed and our place at Wembley gifted to Boro - he'll take direct legal action against SFC to claim damages instead so that we have to pay him to fuck off. Just ask Derby.

Edited 13 hours ago by CSA96

[SaintJackoInHurworth]

I haven't been on SaintsWeb for ages, but felt it might be time for me to weigh in due to my particular insight into this story...

You see, as my username will tell you, I live in the village of Hurworth-on-Tees... which is significant because the Rockliffe training ground is not in Middlesbrough, but is actually in Hurworth-on-Tees. I live right opposite the Rockliffe grounds including Hotel, Golf Club, training ground, cricket club and woods.

I can tell you that there is a lot of rubbish being shared about the story and some of the pictures. Here is my take:

1. The Middlesbrough FC First Team training pitch is on the opposite side of the MFC training centre from the Rockliffe Hotel and golf club.

2. The picture of a boy stood behind a tree filming does not, as far as I can see, tally with anywhere around the first team training pitch.

3. The other picture of a tree beside a gate with training pitches in the background DOES appear to be taken from the gate near to the Rockliffe Golf clubhouse.

4. However, the pitches in the background of that picture are supplementary training pitches and, as stated above, that is not the First Team Training pitch. Those pitches are mainly used by the academy sides and women's sides for their training. However, it is possible that some training could have taken place there, but I'm not convinced any spy would have been able to see significant tactical input in that area.

5. If I were to spy on MFC's first team training, instead of trying to get to the first team training pitch from the golf course, I would walk along the public footpath around the perimeter of Rockliffe and slip through the woods where it is possible to spy on the training pitch. From there you could also stay out of sight of CCTV cameras.

6. I have downloaded an aerial view of Rockliffe using Google and based on my local knowledge I have edited the image to show:

• Where a lot of the rumours about the spying seem to be suggesting the spy was caught
• Where the first team training pitch is
• Where the other training and exhibition pitches are
• The footpaths around the training ground.
• The location of the clubhouse and training centre.
• The rough area where I think any decent spy would have positioned themselves to film training.

Here is the image:

Finally, here is a photo that I took on Friday of the gate near the golf clubhouse where the reports seem to be suggesting the spying took place (with the tree shown!):

You may also be interested with the following video that I took from the lawn of Rockliffe Hotel, which shoots over the top of the grassy roof of the clubhouse and scans around to the training centre: 

 

Edited 11 hours ago by SaintJackoInHurworth
Adding in photo and video

[leeham_69]

1 hour ago, SaintJackoInHurworth said:

I haven't been on SaintsWeb for ages, but felt it might be time for me to weigh in due to my particular insight into this story...

You see, as my username will tell you, I live in the village of Hurworth-on-Tees... which is significant because the Rockliffe training ground is not in Middlesbrough, but is actually in Hurworth-on-Tees. I live right opposite the Rockliffe grounds including Hotel, Golf Club, training ground, cricket club and woods.

I can tell you that there is a lot of rubbish being shared about the story and some of the pictures. Here is my take:

1. The Middlesbrough FC First Team training pitch is on the opposite side of the MFC training centre from the Rockliffe Hotel and golf club.

2. The picture of a boy stood behind a tree filming does not, as far as I can see, tally with anywhere around the first team training pitch.

3. The other picture of a tree beside a gate with training pitches in the background DOES appear to be taken from the gate near to the Rockliffe Golf clubhouse.

4. However, the pitches in the background of that picture are supplementary training pitches and, as stated above, that is not the First Team Training pitch. Those pitches are mainly used by the academy sides and women's sides for their training. However, it is possible that some training could have taken place there, but I'm not convinced any spy would have been able to see significant tactical input in that area.

5. If I were to spy on MFC's first team training, instead of trying to get to the first team training pitch from the golf course, I would walk along the public footpath around the perimeter of Rockliffe and slip through the woods where it is possible to spy on the training pitch. From there you could also stay out of sight of CCTV cameras.

6. I have downloaded an aerial view of Rockliffe using Google and based on my local knowledge I have edited the image to show:

• Where a lot of the rumours about the spying seem to be suggesting the spy was caught
• Where the first team training pitch is
• Where the other training and exhibition pitches are
• The footpaths around the training ground.
• The location of the clubhouse and training centre.
• The rough area where I think any decent spy would have positioned themselves to film training.

Here is the image:

Finally, here is a photo that I took on Friday of the gate near the golf clubhouse where the reports seem to be suggesting the spying took place (with the tree shown!):

You may also be interested with the following video that I took from the lawn of Rockliffe Hotel, which shoots over the top of the grassy roof of the clubhouse and scans around to the training centre: 

 

Thanks for the leg work. This is great. These simple shots and video really undermine the outrage of our Boro friends. You would think a video taken from that spot, at full zoom on an iPhone takes a fair bit of the sting out of the "surveillance equipment" claims. 

PS email this to the club, they might pay you to be their next spy

[benjii]

6 hours ago, Pilchards said:

Between now and the playoff final we need to come up with a song that 36k Saints fans can sing about Middlesbrough.

One last opportunity to stick one back at them for sure.

(1) ‘Are you watching Middlesbrough?’ (Maybe simple but it’s a start)

Adam Johnson, he's one of your own.

[benjii]

1 hour ago, SaintJackoInHurworth said:

I haven't been on SaintsWeb for ages, but felt it might be time for me to weigh in due to my particular insight into this story...

You see, as my username will tell you, I live in the village of Hurworth-on-Tees... which is significant because the Rockliffe training ground is not in Middlesbrough, but is actually in Hurworth-on-Tees. I live right opposite the Rockliffe grounds including Hotel, Golf Club, training ground, cricket club and woods.

I can tell you that there is a lot of rubbish being shared about the story and some of the pictures. Here is my take:

1. The Middlesbrough FC First Team training pitch is on the opposite side of the MFC training centre from the Rockliffe Hotel and golf club.

2. The picture of a boy stood behind a tree filming does not, as far as I can see, tally with anywhere around the first team training pitch.

3. The other picture of a tree beside a gate with training pitches in the background DOES appear to be taken from the gate near to the Rockliffe Golf clubhouse.

4. However, the pitches in the background of that picture are supplementary training pitches and, as stated above, that is not the First Team Training pitch. Those pitches are mainly used by the academy sides and women's sides for their training. However, it is possible that some training could have taken place there, but I'm not convinced any spy would have been able to see significant tactical input in that area.

5. If I were to spy on MFC's first team training, instead of trying to get to the first team training pitch from the golf course, I would walk along the public footpath around the perimeter of Rockliffe and slip through the woods where it is possible to spy on the training pitch. From there you could also stay out of sight of CCTV cameras.

6. I have downloaded an aerial view of Rockliffe using Google and based on my local knowledge I have edited the image to show:

• Where a lot of the rumours about the spying seem to be suggesting the spy was caught
• Where the first team training pitch is
• Where the other training and exhibition pitches are
• The footpaths around the training ground.
• The location of the clubhouse and training centre.
• The rough area where I think any decent spy would have positioned themselves to film training.

Here is the image:

Finally, here is a photo that I took on Friday of the gate near the golf clubhouse where the reports seem to be suggesting the spying took place (with the tree shown!):

You may also be interested with the following video that I took from the lawn of Rockliffe Hotel, which shoots over the top of the grassy roof of the clubhouse and scans around to the training centre: 

 

Send to SFC!

[kwsaint]

2 hours ago, SaintJackoInHurworth said:

I haven't been on SaintsWeb for ages, but felt it might be time for me to weigh in due to my particular insight into this story...

You see, as my username will tell you, I live in the village of Hurworth-on-Tees... which is significant because the Rockliffe training ground is not in Middlesbrough, but is actually in Hurworth-on-Tees. I live right opposite the Rockliffe grounds including Hotel, Golf Club, training ground, cricket club and woods.

I can tell you that there is a lot of rubbish being shared about the story and some of the pictures. Here is my take:

1. The Middlesbrough FC First Team training pitch is on the opposite side of the MFC training centre from the Rockliffe Hotel and golf club.

2. The picture of a boy stood behind a tree filming does not, as far as I can see, tally with anywhere around the first team training pitch.

3. The other picture of a tree beside a gate with training pitches in the background DOES appear to be taken from the gate near to the Rockliffe Golf clubhouse.

4. However, the pitches in the background of that picture are supplementary training pitches and, as stated above, that is not the First Team Training pitch. Those pitches are mainly used by the academy sides and women's sides for their training. However, it is possible that some training could have taken place there, but I'm not convinced any spy would have been able to see significant tactical input in that area.

5. If I were to spy on MFC's first team training, instead of trying to get to the first team training pitch from the golf course, I would walk along the public footpath around the perimeter of Rockliffe and slip through the woods where it is possible to spy on the training pitch. From there you could also stay out of sight of CCTV cameras.

6. I have downloaded an aerial view of Rockliffe using Google and based on my local knowledge I have edited the image to show:

• Where a lot of the rumours about the spying seem to be suggesting the spy was caught
• Where the first team training pitch is
• Where the other training and exhibition pitches are
• The footpaths around the training ground.
• The location of the clubhouse and training centre.
• The rough area where I think any decent spy would have positioned themselves to film training.

Here is the image:

Finally, here is a photo that I took on Friday of the gate near the golf clubhouse where the reports seem to be suggesting the spying took place (with the tree shown!):

You may also be interested with the following video that I took from the lawn of Rockliffe Hotel, which shoots over the top of the grassy roof of the clubhouse and scans around to the training centre: 

 

That’s really useful context. 
 

Genuinely though, it seems to me completely unacceptable for a professional football team, which was once in the PL and may well again, to train in such an open location where anyone could be so close to the action with no security. Given the nutters nowadays, it seems a massive oversight and a threat to their players.

[Miltonaggro]

2 hours ago, SaintJackoInHurworth said:

I haven't been on SaintsWeb for ages, but felt it might be time for me to weigh in due to my particular insight into this story...

You see, as my username will tell you, I live in the village of Hurworth-on-Tees... which is significant because the Rockliffe training ground is not in Middlesbrough, but is actually in Hurworth-on-Tees. I live right opposite the Rockliffe grounds including Hotel, Golf Club, training ground, cricket club and woods.

I can tell you that there is a lot of rubbish being shared about the story and some of the pictures. Here is my take:

1. The Middlesbrough FC First Team training pitch is on the opposite side of the MFC training centre from the Rockliffe Hotel and golf club.

2. The picture of a boy stood behind a tree filming does not, as far as I can see, tally with anywhere around the first team training pitch.

3. The other picture of a tree beside a gate with training pitches in the background DOES appear to be taken from the gate near to the Rockliffe Golf clubhouse.

4. However, the pitches in the background of that picture are supplementary training pitches and, as stated above, that is not the First Team Training pitch. Those pitches are mainly used by the academy sides and women's sides for their training. However, it is possible that some training could have taken place there, but I'm not convinced any spy would have been able to see significant tactical input in that area.

5. If I were to spy on MFC's first team training, instead of trying to get to the first team training pitch from the golf course, I would walk along the public footpath around the perimeter of Rockliffe and slip through the woods where it is possible to spy on the training pitch. From there you could also stay out of sight of CCTV cameras.

6. I have downloaded an aerial view of Rockliffe using Google and based on my local knowledge I have edited the image to show:

• Where a lot of the rumours about the spying seem to be suggesting the spy was caught
• Where the first team training pitch is
• Where the other training and exhibition pitches are
• The footpaths around the training ground.
• The location of the clubhouse and training centre.
• The rough area where I think any decent spy would have positioned themselves to film training.

Here is the image:

Finally, here is a photo that I took on Friday of the gate near the golf clubhouse where the reports seem to be suggesting the spying took place (with the tree shown!):

You may also be interested with the following video that I took from the lawn of Rockliffe Hotel, which shoots over the top of the grassy roof of the clubhouse and scans around to the training centre: 

 

Excellent work. Do email the club.

[NewYorkSaint]

What is everyone making of the fact that ticket info for the final was deleted from Saints' website. Is there any explanation other than that the investigation has told Saints to hold off, implying a) that a ban may be on the table and b) that they intend a quick hearing prior to the final? 

[Matthew Le God]

2 minutes ago, NewYorkSaint said:

What is everyone making of the fact that ticket info for the final was deleted from Saints' website. Is there any explanation other than that the investigation has told Saints to hold off, implying a) that a ban may be on the table and b) that they intend a quick hearing prior to the final? 

It is because Saints jumped the gun and it should have been announced at the same time Hull City publish it.

[obelisk]

3 hours ago, SaintJackoInHurworth said:

I haven't been on SaintsWeb for ages, but felt it might be time for me to weigh in due to my particular insight into this story...

You see, as my username will tell you, I live in the village of Hurworth-on-Tees... which is significant because the Rockliffe training ground is not in Middlesbrough, but is actually in Hurworth-on-Tees. I live right opposite the Rockliffe grounds including Hotel, Golf Club, training ground, cricket club and woods.

I can tell you that there is a lot of rubbish being shared about the story and some of the pictures. Here is my take:

1. The Middlesbrough FC First Team training pitch is on the opposite side of the MFC training centre from the Rockliffe Hotel and golf club.

2. The picture of a boy stood behind a tree filming does not, as far as I can see, tally with anywhere around the first team training pitch.

3. The other picture of a tree beside a gate with training pitches in the background DOES appear to be taken from the gate near to the Rockliffe Golf clubhouse.

4. However, the pitches in the background of that picture are supplementary training pitches and, as stated above, that is not the First Team Training pitch. Those pitches are mainly used by the academy sides and women's sides for their training. However, it is possible that some training could have taken place there, but I'm not convinced any spy would have been able to see significant tactical input in that area.

5. If I were to spy on MFC's first team training, instead of trying to get to the first team training pitch from the golf course, I would walk along the public footpath around the perimeter of Rockliffe and slip through the woods where it is possible to spy on the training pitch. From there you could also stay out of sight of CCTV cameras.

6. I have downloaded an aerial view of Rockliffe using Google and based on my local knowledge I have edited the image to show:

• Where a lot of the rumours about the spying seem to be suggesting the spy was caught
• Where the first team training pitch is
• Where the other training and exhibition pitches are
• The footpaths around the training ground.
• The location of the clubhouse and training centre.
• The rough area where I think any decent spy would have positioned themselves to film training.

Here is the image:

Finally, here is a photo that I took on Friday of the gate near the golf clubhouse where the reports seem to be suggesting the spying took place (with the tree shown!):

You may also be interested with the following video that I took from the lawn of Rockliffe Hotel, which shoots over the top of the grassy roof of the clubhouse and scans around to the training centre: 

 

Thanks for that. Any idea whether Boro really are continuing to train in the expectation that all this will moaning will get them a place at Wembley? Or is it just more hogwash?

[benjii]

The more the actual detail comes out, the more this looks like a very minor technical infringement at worse, and the more the Mboro manager and hierarchy look ridiculous. 

[LGTL]

5 minutes ago, benjii said:

The more the actual detail comes out, the more this looks like a very minor technical infringement at worse, and the more the Mboro manager and hierarchy look ridiculous. 

Absolutely. That post by the lad who lives near the training ground adds some excellent local context. Boro fans are caught in an echo chamber over a relatively minor infringement. They’re going to be extremely disappointed later today. 

[trousers]

32 minutes ago, NewYorkSaint said:

What is everyone making of the fact that ticket info for the final was deleted from Saints' website. Is there any explanation other than that the investigation has told Saints to hold off, implying a) that a ban may be on the table and b) that they intend a quick hearing prior to the final? 

 

29 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

It is because Saints jumped the gun and it should have been announced at the same time Hull City publish it.

Seems a bit odd to me that the EFL require clubs to coordinate pre-ticket sales info. All we publicised was our own ticket sales timetable (which will inevitably be different to Hull's anyway)... Just a bit of admin info really. I can understand why the EFL would want to coordinate the actual sale of tickets, but cannot see any reason to need to align the publication of practical / logistical info in the lead up to that. Probably nothing in it but still a tad bizarre IMO.

Edited 8 hours ago by trousers

[obelisk]

30 minutes ago, benjii said:

The more the actual detail comes out, the more this looks like a very minor technical infringement at worse, and the more the Mboro manager and hierarchy look ridiculous. 

Indeed. Something that was allowed one day but not the next. Minor infringement.

[Weston Super Saint]

8 hours ago, Pilchards said:

Between now and the playoff final we need to come up with a song that 36k Saints fans can sing about Middlesbrough.

One last opportunity to stick one back at them for sure.

(1) ‘Are you watching Middlesbrough?’ (Maybe simple but it’s a start)

The chant from outside on Tuesday : "we spy where we want, we spy where we want...."

[sandwichsaint]

3 hours ago, SaintJackoInHurworth said:

I haven't been on SaintsWeb for ages, but felt it might be time for me to weigh in due to my particular insight into this story...

You see, as my username will tell you, I live in the village of Hurworth-on-Tees... which is significant because the Rockliffe training ground is not in Middlesbrough, but is actually in Hurworth-on-Tees. I live right opposite the Rockliffe grounds including Hotel, Golf Club, training ground, cricket club and woods.

I can tell you that there is a lot of rubbish being shared about the story and some of the pictures. Here is my take:

1. The Middlesbrough FC First Team training pitch is on the opposite side of the MFC training centre from the Rockliffe Hotel and golf club.

2. The picture of a boy stood behind a tree filming does not, as far as I can see, tally with anywhere around the first team training pitch.

3. The other picture of a tree beside a gate with training pitches in the background DOES appear to be taken from the gate near to the Rockliffe Golf clubhouse.

4. However, the pitches in the background of that picture are supplementary training pitches and, as stated above, that is not the First Team Training pitch. Those pitches are mainly used by the academy sides and women's sides for their training. However, it is possible that some training could have taken place there, but I'm not convinced any spy would have been able to see significant tactical input in that area.

5. If I were to spy on MFC's first team training, instead of trying to get to the first team training pitch from the golf course, I would walk along the public footpath around the perimeter of Rockliffe and slip through the woods where it is possible to spy on the training pitch. From there you could also stay out of sight of CCTV cameras.

6. I have downloaded an aerial view of Rockliffe using Google and based on my local knowledge I have edited the image to show:

• Where a lot of the rumours about the spying seem to be suggesting the spy was caught
• Where the first team training pitch is
• Where the other training and exhibition pitches are
• The footpaths around the training ground.
• The location of the clubhouse and training centre.
• The rough area where I think any decent spy would have positioned themselves to film training.

Here is the image:

Finally, here is a photo that I took on Friday of the gate near the golf clubhouse where the reports seem to be suggesting the spying took place (with the tree shown!):

You may also be interested with the following video that I took from the lawn of Rockliffe Hotel, which shoots over the top of the grassy roof of the clubhouse and scans around to the training centre: 

 

Don’t suppose you’ve got family or friends in Hull have you?

[BotleySaint]

28 minutes ago, LGTL said:

They’re going to be extremely disappointed later today. 

I agree with you their case is pathetic and certainly doesn't warrant us being expelled from the playoffs.
But they have created a media storm and the EFL may decide to cave in to the "popular" opinion.

[Dman]

3 hours ago, SaintJackoInHurworth said:

I haven't been on SaintsWeb for ages, but felt it might be time for me to weigh in due to my particular insight into this story...

You see, as my username will tell you, I live in the village of Hurworth-on-Tees... which is significant because the Rockliffe training ground is not in Middlesbrough, but is actually in Hurworth-on-Tees. I live right opposite the Rockliffe grounds including Hotel, Golf Club, training ground, cricket club and woods.

I can tell you that there is a lot of rubbish being shared about the story and some of the pictures. Here is my take:

1. The Middlesbrough FC First Team training pitch is on the opposite side of the MFC training centre from the Rockliffe Hotel and golf club.

2. The picture of a boy stood behind a tree filming does not, as far as I can see, tally with anywhere around the first team training pitch.

3. The other picture of a tree beside a gate with training pitches in the background DOES appear to be taken from the gate near to the Rockliffe Golf clubhouse.

4. However, the pitches in the background of that picture are supplementary training pitches and, as stated above, that is not the First Team Training pitch. Those pitches are mainly used by the academy sides and women's sides for their training. However, it is possible that some training could have taken place there, but I'm not convinced any spy would have been able to see significant tactical input in that area.

5. If I were to spy on MFC's first team training, instead of trying to get to the first team training pitch from the golf course, I would walk along the public footpath around the perimeter of Rockliffe and slip through the woods where it is possible to spy on the training pitch. From there you could also stay out of sight of CCTV cameras.

6. I have downloaded an aerial view of Rockliffe using Google and based on my local knowledge I have edited the image to show:

• Where a lot of the rumours about the spying seem to be suggesting the spy was caught
• Where the first team training pitch is
• Where the other training and exhibition pitches are
• The footpaths around the training ground.
• The location of the clubhouse and training centre.
• The rough area where I think any decent spy would have positioned themselves to film training.

Here is the image:

Finally, here is a photo that I took on Friday of the gate near the golf clubhouse where the reports seem to be suggesting the spying took place (with the tree shown!):

You may also be interested with the following video that I took from the lawn of Rockliffe Hotel, which shoots over the top of the grassy roof of the clubhouse and scans around to the training centre: 

 

In the unlikley event of them replacing us in the PO final, please round up as many people as possible and spend the week 'spying on thier training sessions'

Extra points if you can get some footage and leak it online (or send to Hull). 

As a member of the public filming in a public place, there is nothing they can do about it 😃

[Weston Super Saint]

7 hours ago, trousers said:

Yep, good points. I'd even go as far as suggesting that @SaintlyAnd puts his ex-analyst friend in touch with the club as it sounds like he has some relevant intel that could be used in our defence 👍🏻

That, and we may be in need of a new analyst by the end of the week....

[Harry_SFC]

7 minutes ago, BotleySaint said:

I agree with you their case is pathetic and certainly doesn't warrant us being expelled from the playoffs.
But they have created a media storm and the EFL may decide to cave in to the "popular" opinion.

The independent panel shouldn't be "caving in" to anyone. They are there to look at evidence and make a decision based on that. If there is any caving in then Saints will obviously win on appeal. 

[Dman]

1 hour ago, NewYorkSaint said:

What is everyone making of the fact that ticket info for the final was deleted from Saints' website. Is there any explanation other than that the investigation has told Saints to hold off, implying a) that a ban may be on the table and b) that they intend a quick hearing prior to the final? 

My thoughts; 

1. We have released them knowing that expulsion is off the cards and got a bit of a slap on the wrist from the EFL, who want to look as if it is for now. 

2. We've done it to try and apply pressure to the EFL (as boro have been doing). Although I don't really think that achieves anything and just makes us look a little silly. 

 

[Dman]

9 hours ago, Pilchards said:

Between now and the playoff final we need to come up with a song that 36k Saints fans can sing about Middlesbrough.

One last opportunity to stick one back at them for sure.

(1) ‘Are you watching Middlesbrough?’ (Maybe simple but it’s a start)

"Kim Hellberg, we all watched you cry"

[Weston Super Saint]

1 hour ago, NewYorkSaint said:

What is everyone making of the fact that ticket info for the final was deleted from Saints' website. Is there any explanation other than that the investigation has told Saints to hold off, implying a) that a ban may be on the table and b) that they intend a quick hearing prior to the final? 

The rules state we have 14 days to respond.  Whilst Boro wanted a 'quick hearing' we are entitled to follow the rules.  The EFL would need to change the rules to get a 'quick hearing' which would take a lot longer than the 14 days we have to respond.

There really is nothing to see regarding that point.

[Dman]

Just now, Weston Super Saint said:

The rules state we have 14 days to respond.  Whilst Boro wanted a 'quick hearing' we are entitled to follow the rules.  The EFL would need to change the rules to get a 'quick hearing' which would take a lot longer than the 14 days we have to respond.

There really is nothing to see regarding that point.

Maybe saints tainted glasses here, but I think there is a world where the EFL want this cleared up ASAP so they might have said to saints... 

If you agree to an expedited process, we will remove explusion from the table. 

Keeps everyone happy in that case. 

[Andy Hill]

Call me a pessimist but the surge in media pressure calling us “cheats” could have a massive impact.

[Weston Super Saint]

1 minute ago, Dman said:

Maybe saints tainted glasses here, but I think there is a world where the EFL want this cleared up ASAP so they might have said to saints... 

If you agree to an expedited process, we will remove explusion from the table. 

Keeps everyone happy in that case. 

You seem to be suggesting the EFL will be dictating the outcomes to the independent panel.  Surely that would throw the integrity of the investigation into doubt and we would win any appeal?

Let's hope we have any such suggestion in writing - or used our high tech, super spy recording equipment (iphone 14) to record the conversation  

[coalman]

Just now, Andy Hill said:

Call me a pessimist but the surge in media pressure calling us “cheats” could have a massive impact.

Which is, no doubt, the intention. However, there's a reason that your solicitor tells you not to talk in public while there's a case going on. You can't win a case in the court of public opinion but you can definitely lose it by trying to fight it there.

As Simon Jordan said on behalf of his mate "Gibbo" it's about getting Saints to try and settle now and extracting as much money from them as possible. If the EFL kicks us out and they get reinstated it's just a bonus.

[Saint_clark]

4 hours ago, SaintJackoInHurworth said:

I haven't been on SaintsWeb for ages, but felt it might be time for me to weigh in due to my particular insight into this story...

You see, as my username will tell you, I live in the village of Hurworth-on-Tees... which is significant because the Rockliffe training ground is not in Middlesbrough, but is actually in Hurworth-on-Tees. I live right opposite the Rockliffe grounds including Hotel, Golf Club, training ground, cricket club and woods.

I can tell you that there is a lot of rubbish being shared about the story and some of the pictures. Here is my take:

1. The Middlesbrough FC First Team training pitch is on the opposite side of the MFC training centre from the Rockliffe Hotel and golf club.

2. The picture of a boy stood behind a tree filming does not, as far as I can see, tally with anywhere around the first team training pitch.

3. The other picture of a tree beside a gate with training pitches in the background DOES appear to be taken from the gate near to the Rockliffe Golf clubhouse.

4. However, the pitches in the background of that picture are supplementary training pitches and, as stated above, that is not the First Team Training pitch. Those pitches are mainly used by the academy sides and women's sides for their training. However, it is possible that some training could have taken place there, but I'm not convinced any spy would have been able to see significant tactical input in that area.

5. If I were to spy on MFC's first team training, instead of trying to get to the first team training pitch from the golf course, I would walk along the public footpath around the perimeter of Rockliffe and slip through the woods where it is possible to spy on the training pitch. From there you could also stay out of sight of CCTV cameras.

6. I have downloaded an aerial view of Rockliffe using Google and based on my local knowledge I have edited the image to show:

• Where a lot of the rumours about the spying seem to be suggesting the spy was caught
• Where the first team training pitch is
• Where the other training and exhibition pitches are
• The footpaths around the training ground.
• The location of the clubhouse and training centre.
• The rough area where I think any decent spy would have positioned themselves to film training.

Here is the image:

Finally, here is a photo that I took on Friday of the gate near the golf clubhouse where the reports seem to be suggesting the spying took place (with the tree shown!):

You may also be interested with the following video that I took from the lawn of Rockliffe Hotel, which shoots over the top of the grassy roof of the clubhouse and scans around to the training centre: 

 

As others have said it may be worth sending this to the club. Middlesbrough are being totally misleading about where this guy was.

[coalman]

3 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

You seem to be suggesting the EFL will be dictating the outcomes to the independent panel.  Surely that would throw the integrity of the investigation into doubt and we would win any appeal?

Let's hope we have any such suggestion in writing - or used our high tech, super spy recording equipment (iphone 14) to record the conversation  

Except any offer or discussion is going to come with "WITHOUT PREJUDICE" attached.

[coalman]

1 minute ago, Saint_clark said:

As others have said it may be worth sending this to the club. Middlesbrough are being totally misleading about where this guy was.

We've only seen one photo released. We don't know what other CCTV (or other footage) they have. Have to imagine that's not the sum total of the media Boro have for this.

[benjii]

40 minutes ago, BotleySaint said:

I agree with you their case is pathetic and certainly doesn't warrant us being expelled from the playoffs.
But they have created a media storm and the EFL may decide to cave in to the "popular" opinion.

Why? That just exposes the EFL to legal action and the possibility of the final not going ahead as scheduled. Will be a 'mare for them.

Also, worth considering the impact if this is, in fact, quite a common practice and the precedent that a sanction other than a fine and maybe a small points deduction sets.

Edited 7 hours ago by benjii