Will Still

[Weston Super Saint]

14 hours ago, DT said:

Does anyone think the board will grow a pair and sack the useless sham of a coach?

Didn't he appoint that lady last year to take control of things?  Apologies can't remember her name as I guess she hasn't made much of an impact!

 

[Osvaldorama]

8 hours ago, Willo of Whiteley said:

I’m frustrated he stuck with five at the back, and I’ve said multiple times he doesn’t help himself by playing players out of position and starting matches in defensive formations. That part is on him massively. 

The argument is that we’ve created more than enough chances along the way and he’s been let down by poor recruitment in key positions, as demonstrated - defensively and with a goalkeeper, and a striker.

Do I think he’ll turn it around? Honestly I’m not sure.
I want it to work but Christ he needs to go out and attack a game with an attacking formation.

That argument about players messing it up worked before this weekend, imo. 

But we were just schooled by the worst team in the league. They haven’t won a home game in months, yet they probably should have won by more. For me that says we have even bigger issues than just players missing chances. 

Personally I honestly really, really don’t want to change manager again, as I’m sick of it and we are starting to look ridiculous. 

However, that is literally the only reason I can think of to keep him currently. Everything else about his tenure so far is a disaster. 
 

[Harry_SFC]

3 minutes ago, Osvaldorama said:

That argument about players messing it up worked before this weekend, imo. 

But we were just schooled by the worst team in the league. They haven’t won a home game in months, yet they probably should have won by more. For me that says we have even bigger issues than just players missing chances. 

Personally I honestly really, really don’t want to change manager again, as I’m sick of it and we are starting to look ridiculous. 

However, that is literally the only reason I can think of to keep him currently. Everything else about his tenure so far is a disaster. 
 

Agreed. It's becoming tiresome chopping and changing but it's SR's own fault because their appointments have been shambolic. I think they will give him until the next international break at least but I can't see him sorting this mess out because I'm not sure he knows how to. 

[Bob60]

9 hours ago, Willo of Whiteley said:

I’m frustrated he stuck with five at the back, and I’ve said multiple times he doesn’t help himself by playing players out of position and starting matches in defensive formations. That part is on him massively. 

The argument is that we’ve created more than enough chances along the way and he’s been let down by poor recruitment in key positions, as demonstrated - defensively and with a goalkeeper, and a striker.

Do I think he’ll turn it around? Honestly I’m not sure.
I want it to work but Christ he needs to go out and attack a game with an attacking formation.

I take some of your points and of course the players must take a lot of the blame, but as well as not scoring we continue to concede stupid goals and have the mentality of a jellyfish. Probably the worse thing for us is taking the lead, we just then fall apart. 

So what part of that is the manager responsible for if not attack, defence or mentality?

Also I get the arguement about not changing and a manager needs time to learn and grow but had anyone seen any evidence that he is learning, I think he is getting worse. 

Finally I think the problems are higher up but realistically we can't change that or the players so the only realistic change is the manager.

[Cabrone]

He's had enough time now and all the evidence says it hasn't worked. No offence WS but I think your time is up.

Trouble is SR would only go and appoint another unproven manager who is likely to see us descend even further.

I wanted Sean Dyche last season, if we'd have gone all out to get him who knows we might have bagged him and would be in a different place now.

What have they got against hiring a decent proven manager?

[Dman]

2 minutes ago, Cabrone said:

He's had enough time now and all the evidence says it hasn't worked. No offence WS but I think your time is up.

Trouble is SR would only go and appoint another unproven manager who is likely to see us descend even further.

I wanted Sean Dyche last season, if we'd have gone all out to get him who knows we might have bagged him and would be in a different place now.

What have they got against hiring a decent proven manager?

Dyche is such a poor suggestion. Maybe he is the type of manager we need (I don't agree personally, I think we need to go back to that "red bull" high-press style), but regardless of that, there is absolutely no way Dyche would have taken us over last season and done any better than Juric or Still has. 

We simply do not have the squad for a manager such as Dyche, big sam etc. 

[benjii]

11 hours ago, Willo of Whiteley said:

Agree with this

Obviously Still isn't responsible for every error. And for every manager in history who has done a bad job you can find a reel of players making mistakes. This really isn't the point.

For me, the question is, putting aside misses: 

- after a quarter of a season, do we look good? No.

- how many matches have we dominated and been clearly the better side? Maybe 2? 

- how many matches have we looked comfortable and won comfortably? Zero.

- are we playing entertaining football and using the expensive attacked talent we have? Not really.

- is there obvious progression in line with a plan, such as you can accept a few bumps in the road as you can see the end in sight? No, not really.

- is it reasonable to expect a manager with our squad to be doing far, FAR, better? Yes, definitely. 

[Lighthouse]

11 hours ago, Willo of Whiteley said:

Agree with this

That video is very good evidence of why we're sixth instead of fighting for the top two.

 

 

 

We aren't sixth though, are we?

[Dman]

5 minutes ago, benjii said:

Obviously Still isn't responsible for every error. And for every manager in history who has done a bad job you can find a reel of players making mistakes. This really isn't the point.

For me, the question is, putting aside misses: 

- after a quarter of a season, do we look good? No.

- how many matches have we dominated and been clearly the better side? Maybe 2? 

- how many matches have we looked comfortable and won comfortably? Zero.

- are we playing entertaining football and using the expensive attacked talent we have? Not really.

- is there obvious progression in line with a plan, such as you can accept a few bumps in the road as you can see the end in sight? No, not really.

- is it reasonable to expect a manager with our squad to be doing far, FAR, better? Yes, definitely. 

Exactly.

Its easy to highlight 1 or 2 chances a game and assume a striker should score every single one of them (not even Haaland would do that), but that doesn't highlight the fact the 95% of those games has been completely insufferable to watch. 

[AlexLaw76]

The Total Saints Podcast put a great deal of the blame on the players.

we have many new players, both on the pitch and on the bench, did the come with a shit attitude?

[Paul Chuckle]

5 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

That video is very good evidence of why we're sixth instead of fighting for the top two.

 

 

 

We aren't sixth though, are we?

Would be interesting to see a video of all the misses against us as well to balance things out, as I'm sure from memory Wrexham and Sheffield Utd missed big chances against us.

[AlexLaw76]

1 minute ago, Paul Chuckle said:

Would be interesting to see a video of all the misses against us as well to balance things out, as I'm sure from memory Wrexham and Sheffield Utd missed big chances against us.

Pompey were the better side also

[Saint NL]

8 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

why we're sixth instead of fighting for the top two.

 

 

 

We aren't sixth though, are we?

Even better than that, we're 5th.

 

 

 

From bottom.

[skintsaint]

8 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Pompey were the better side also

First half they were, but don't remember them missing any sitters.

[Forester]

No wish to repeat prior post but I would not be pulling trigger yet as we risk becoming a figure of fun club a la Watford, and we have played just 12 games.  We need to see strong improvement between now and the halfway mark, when I think it is more credible to make a change if nothing gets better.

On the wider “club in chaos” point, over the last few years I agree most SR decisions have been poor and they retain responsibility for this mess.  However I don’t think things are quite so helpless as some make out right now.  Here are reasons not to reach for the pistol and whiskey (as hard as Saints make it!)

- while there are some poor signings (Downs) thee are several players who have shown early signs of being really good acquisitions, specifically Jelert, Jander and Scienza.  In one window under Spors that isn’t tragic, but a clear mistake made in striker department. Along with experienced but currently under performing players in the squad that is the bones of a good side, but we have really only seen about 180 mins of good football so far.

- if Spors goes (and it will be fascinating to understand what his contract says re release clause) we now have a head of recruitment who has been here for months and would have primary responsibility for lining up potential signings.  Its then over to an exec to actually negotiate the terms.  That isn’t end of the world.

- what is more tricky is if Still needs sacking (see above) then who makes that decision is absence of Spors and who appoints?  This may play in Still’s favour to be given more time

[Sir Ralph]

22 minutes ago, Lighthouse said:

That video is very good evidence of why we're sixth instead of fighting for the top two.

 

 

 

We aren't sixth though, are we?

When you watch this you have to wonder. The players have more to answer for than Still I think . Still job to hold them accountable

[Give it to Ron]

32 minutes ago, Forester said:

No wish to repeat prior post but I would not be pulling trigger yet as we risk becoming a figure of fun club a la Watford, and we have played just 12 games.  We need to see strong improvement between now and the halfway mark, when I think it is more credible to make a change if nothing gets better.

On the wider “club in chaos” point, over the last few years I agree most SR decisions have been poor and they retain responsibility for this mess.  However I don’t think things are quite so helpless as some make out right now.  Here are reasons not to reach for the pistol and whiskey (as hard as Saints make it!)

- while there are some poor signings (Downs) thee are several players who have shown early signs of being really good acquisitions, specifically Jelert, Jander and Scienza.  In one window under Spors that isn’t tragic, but a clear mistake made in striker department. Along with experienced but currently under performing players in the squad that is the bones of a good side, but we have really only seen about 180 mins of good football so far.

- if Spors goes (and it will be fascinating to understand what his contract says re release clause) we now have a head of recruitment who has been here for months and would have primary responsibility for lining up potential signings.  Its then over to an exec to actually negotiate the terms.  That isn’t end of the world.

- what is more tricky is if Still needs sacking (see above) then who makes that decision is absence of Spors and who appoints?  This may play in Still’s favour to be given more time

Fair comment - I know you go to aways and games like me so what games has Still shown any tactical nous, flexibility or a decent sub which considering our squad is bad?

We are only like Watford because we have as bad ownership like them if SR actually recruited well we wouldn’t be.

its all my fault I wanted Puel gone blame me 🙂

[Baird of the land]

Can't believe the clown hasn't been sacked yet. Guess they are waiting for him to actually put us in the relegation zone.

[tdmickey3]

43 minutes ago, Forester said:

No wish to repeat prior post but I would not be pulling trigger yet as we risk becoming a figure of fun club a la Watford, and we have played just 12 games.  We need to see strong improvement between now and the halfway mark, when I think it is more credible to make a change if nothing gets better.

On the wider “club in chaos” point, over the last few years I agree most SR decisions have been poor and they retain responsibility for this mess.  However I don’t think things are quite so helpless as some make out right now.  Here are reasons not to reach for the pistol and whiskey (as hard as Saints make it!)

- while there are some poor signings (Downs) thee are several players who have shown early signs of being really good acquisitions, specifically Jelert, Jander and Scienza.  In one window under Spors that isn’t tragic, but a clear mistake made in striker department. Along with experienced but currently under performing players in the squad that is the bones of a good side, but we have really only seen about 180 mins of good football so far.

- if Spors goes (and it will be fascinating to understand what his contract says re release clause) we now have a head of recruitment who has been here for months and would have primary responsibility for lining up potential signings.  Its then over to an exec to actually negotiate the terms.  That isn’t end of the world.

- what is more tricky is if Still needs sacking (see above) then who makes that decision is absence of Spors and who appoints?  This may play in Still’s favour to be given more time

We already are absolute laughing stock..

[tdmickey3]

18 minutes ago, Baird of the land said:

Can't believe the clown hasn't been sacked yet. Guess they are waiting for him to actually put us in the relegation zone.

After weekend then?

[Mr X]

1 hour ago, benjii said:

Obviously Still isn't responsible for every error. And for every manager in history who has done a bad job you can find a reel of players making mistakes. This really isn't the point.

For me, the question is, putting aside misses: 

- after a quarter of a season, do we look good? No.

- how many matches have we dominated and been clearly the better side? Maybe 2? 

- how many matches have we looked comfortable and won comfortably? Zero.

- are we playing entertaining football and using the expensive attacked talent we have? Not really.

- is there obvious progression in line with a plan, such as you can accept a few bumps in the road as you can see the end in sight? No, not really.

- is it reasonable to expect a manager with our squad to be doing far, FAR, better? Yes, definitely. 

This sums it up really... His time is up but we all know SRs replacement would be even worse so what's the point? Till SR decide they are done with their plaything the mess and pain goes on! 

[Fitzhugh Fella]

I keep reading the line "we don't want to become another Watford" I get it but........but right now I would swop places with them in the league.

[Gloucester Saint]

38 minutes ago, Fitzhugh Fella said:

I keep reading the line "we don't want to become another Watford" I get it but........but right now I would swop places with them in the league.

Their club is another player trading mess but at least there is a semblance of a playing spine and the manager - for this month at least - has managed at this level before. Their goalkeepers aren’t a total write off and they do sign the odd effective striker. So some improvement on Saints albeit not huge.

Edited yesterday at 11:46 by Gloucester Saint

[Sevvy]

You know what will happen on Saturday, we will beat Preston 4-0,

[Farmer Saint]

So, will will still still be here at the weekend?

[RedArmy]

4 hours ago, Osvaldorama said:

 

Personally I honestly really, really don’t want to change manager again, as I’m sick of it and we are starting to look ridiculous. 


 

Honestly, who cares at this point? We’d look a lot more ridiculous sticking with him and ending up in league one. 
 

Football fans have got short memories anyway, I bet most have forgotten about Selles at Sheffield united already. 
 

 

[Jack]

1 hour ago, Sevvy said:

You know what will happen on Saturday, we will beat Preston 4-0,

Not a chance, they’re a very competent side 

[DT]

3 hours ago, Baird of the land said:

Can't believe the clown hasn't been sacked yet. Guess they are waiting for him to actually put us in the relegation zone.

I just saw an email in my inbox and got a short spurt of hope before seeing it wasn't about the pseudo being sacked. We blunder on. Countdown to his next five at the back and desperate three subs at once bollocks.

Honestly this club is totally shit right now

[st column saint]

2 hours ago, Sevvy said:

You know what will happen on Saturday, we will beat Preston 4-0,

Nurse he's out of bed again. 🤪

[HKsaint]

2 hours ago, Farmer Saint said:

So, will will still still be here at the weekend?

Yes, will still will still be here at the weekend. 

Edited yesterday at 14:03 by HKsaint

[saintoaks]

https://www.southamptonfc.com/en/video/watch-will-stills-first-interview-as-saints-manager Can safely say we are not doing alot of what he said we would do !!

[DT]

What are they waiting for? Why is he still here?

[Forester]

4 hours ago, Give it to Ron said:

Fair comment - I know you go to aways and games like me so what games has Still shown any tactical nous, flexibility or a decent sub which considering our squad is bad?

We are only like Watford because we have as bad ownership like them if SR actually recruited well we wouldn’t be.

its all my fault I wanted Puel gone blame me 🙂

Trust me I get it, he has a lot to prove in my eyes too.  Think the wider SR context is key too

[Lee On Solent Saint]

33 minutes ago, saintoaks said:

https://www.southamptonfc.com/en/video/watch-will-stills-first-interview-as-saints-manager Can safely say we are not doing alot of what he said we would do !!

Begs the question, why aren't we?

[Green]

5 minutes ago, Lee On Solent Saint said:

Begs the question, why aren't we?

Because he’s not a good enough coach/manager. 
The team don’t look physically fit and seem to have no idea of the game plan, what they are supposed to be doing and his substitutions make us worse. 

[Football Special]

6 hours ago, Sir Ralph said:

When you watch this you have to wonder. The players have more to answer for than Still I think . Still job to hold them accountable

Players.....and the board for not recruiting a striker in summer transfer window 

[BARCELONASAINT]

7 minutes ago, Football Special said:

Players.....and the board for not recruiting a striker in summer transfer window 

WS is the manager, he makes the decisions about tactics and substitutions. His tactics are absolute bollocks and don't even get me started on his subs. He has admitted it was his mistake taking Leo off on Saturday and that decision completely backfired. The entire fanbase were screaming wtf are you doing?? He hasn't got a bloody clue!

[DT]

Tick. Tock. We still have a snake oil salesman in charge. Hired by a grifter. In a club with no soul. Great.

[OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint]

21 minutes ago, BARCELONASAINT said:

WS is the manager, he makes the decisions about tactics and substitutions. His tactics are absolute bollocks and don't even get me started on his subs. He has admitted it was his mistake taking Leo off on Saturday and that decision completely backfired. The entire fanbase were screaming wtf are you doing?? He hasn't got a bloody clue!

His substitutions have been consistently poor all season.

But what I don't get is surely there are coaches and players at the club that should be advising him to try four at the back and what substitutions could work. If the entire fanbase is screaming wtf are you doing (which most of us are) surely the players and coaches must be too

[Turkish]

it's a shame really. After hearing his podcast a while back he came across well and seemed a decent guy. Talks a good game and came with a big reputation. However there has been very little evidence so far that he is anything more than that. You can argue all you like about individual errors and missed chances but his formations, tactics and in game changes are horrendous. Saturday was the nail in the coffin for me, taking Scienza off cost us the game. He was head and shoulders the best player on the pitch to replace him with Stephens in CM made absolutely no sense, even 2 days on it beggars belief. We were a disorganised rabble afterwards with no one any idea what they should be doing. Shame but wrong guy at the wrong time. 

[West Dean FC Legend]

39 minutes ago, Turkish said:

it's a shame really. After hearing his podcast a while back he came across well and seemed a decent guy. Talks a good game and came with a big reputation. However there has been very little evidence so far that he is anything more than that. You can argue all you like about individual errors and missed chances but his formations, tactics and in game changes are horrendous. Saturday was the nail in the coffin for me, taking Scienza off cost us the game. He was head and shoulders the best player on the pitch to replace him with Stephens in CM made absolutely no sense, even 2 days on it beggars belief. We were a disorganised rabble afterwards with no one any idea what they should be doing. Shame but wrong guy at the wrong time. 

I can't get my head around the sick players picked, not picked, taxis, a bloke with no number on his shirt, this seems isimilar to a Sunday morning team going and knocking on a mate's front door to get him because they're short - except of course how many people at Saints are involved in the organisation and running of the first team and match day squad and are professionals and it is all the do for a living, and get paid very well for it I would imagine....

Edited yesterday at 18:04 by West Dean FC Legend

[Turkish]

3 minutes ago, West Dean FC Legend said:

I can't get my head around the sick players picked, not picked, taxis, a bloke with no number on his shirt, this seems isimilar to a Sunday morning team going and knocking on a mate's front door to get him because they're short - except of course how many people at Saints are involved in the organisation and running of the first team and match day squad and are professionals and it is all the do for a living, and get paid very well for it I would imagine....

Same it’s just shambolic. 

[badgerx16]

10 minutes ago, West Dean FC Legend said:

I can't get my head around the sick players picked, not picked, taxis, a bloke with no number on his shirt, this seems isimilar to a Sunday morning team going and knocking on a mate's front door to get him because they're short - except of course how many people at Saints are involved in the organisation and running of the first team and match day squad and are professionals and it is all the do for a living, and get paid very well for it I would imagine....

We have been consistently told about how large our squad is, so surely there is enough cover to compensate for three or four reporting sick. Where were Aribo, Matsuki, and Edozie ? I'm not aware that they were injured.

[Convict Colony]

The issue is that no manager in the world can make armstrong, archer score their 1 on 1's or fix Ross Stewart.

Downs was signed by Spors to try and support this but is too raw and needs time and the unlying issue at Forward/Goalkeeper is on Spors and therefore SR who gave him the budget.

He obvs thought in some area's we had bigger issues and had "enough" to get through the championship.

Wouldnt be a surprise if in not moving out aribo/edozie (who had about 3 clubs trying to buy him) also cost us our ability to bring in another forward etc, hopefully in Jan that is addressed.

 

 

[Badger]

50 minutes ago, OnceaSaintalwaysaSaint said:

His substitutions have been consistently poor all season.

But what I don't get is surely there are coaches and players at the club that should be advising him to try four at the back and what substitutions could work. If the entire fanbase is screaming wtf are you doing (which most of us are) surely the players and coaches must be too

Someone made a comment on here some weeks ago from what he's seen at St Mary's that he doesn't seem to spend any time speaking with the other coaches on touchline. He appeared a bit isolated on Saturday in his Technical Area. 

Perhaps he lacks the support of those he's worked with previously. Always seemed strange that he arrived without an assistant or others as his back up. 

[verlaine1979]

Midfield seems to be where we have the greatest embarrassment of riches, but by playing 5 at the back we allow a 2 of Charles + whoever to be overrun pretty much by whoever we're playing against. With the players we have, we should at the very least be dominant in the middle of the pitch if nowhere else, and we aren't. That's 100% on Still.

[Mboto Gorge]

1 hour ago, Turkish said:

it's a shame really. After hearing his podcast a while back he came across well and seemed a decent guy. Talks a good game and came with a big reputation. However there has been very little evidence so far that he is anything more than that. You can argue all you like about individual errors and missed chances but his formations, tactics and in game changes are horrendous. Saturday was the nail in the coffin for me, taking Scienza off cost us the game. He was head and shoulders the best player on the pitch to replace him with Stephens in CM made absolutely no sense, even 2 days on it beggars belief. We were a disorganised rabble afterwards with no one any idea what they should be doing. Shame but wrong guy at the wrong time. 

Indeed, I’d go as far as saying that’s the worst tactical/unenforced substitution I’ve ever seen in my life from a saints manager. I’ve completely lost any remaining faith I had in him after that. He isn’t winning many games for us this season based on his tactics and game management, he’s way way too negative to the point we will rarely, if ever, kill a game off with him in charge. I don’t even think we will beat Sheffield Wednesday if he’s still manager. If we go a goal up he will shit the bed and it’ll end up 1-1. And that’s if we even go a goal up to start with. Hes got to go

[Gloucester Saint]

2 hours ago, Football Special said:

Players.....and the board for not recruiting a striker in summer transfer window 

They recruited one and for a decent Champ level fee.

Sadly he’s a Wessex League footballer. Bristol City manager was saying that Bundesliga 2 is a lot weaker and less intensive than the Championship, and hence you have to be selective who you sign from there and expect instant performance. 

Edited 23 hours ago by Gloucester Saint

[Mboto Gorge]

1 minute ago, Gloucester Saint said:

They recruited one and for a decent Champ level fee.

Sadly he’s a Wessex League footballer. Bristol City manager was saying that Bundesliga 2 is a lot weaker and less intensive than the Championship, and hence you have to be selective who you sign from there and expect instant performance. 

Surely you’re not saying that SR and Spors don’t have a clue about what to look for when recruiting adequate players for English football? 

[Saint NL]

Finally a bit of leadership from a player....

 

"Ship loads more out" doesn't sound good