Middlesbrough 4-0 Saints - Match Thread

[saintant]

2 hours ago, Lighthouse said:

If you replaced Bazunu with an average League 1 keeper, then since Tonda took over we'd have:

• Beaten Millwall 2-1, as he'd have saved the first and third
• Beaten Norwich 1-0, as he'd have saved the first at his near post and come out and caught the second
• Drawn 1-1 at Oxford as their winner was nowhere near the keeper
• Beaten Birmingham 1-0, as he wouldn't have flapped at that looping header.
• Lost 1-0 today but that's our only defeat and the GD would be much better than after a 4-0.

 

That gives us a record of P13 W9 D3 L1. 30 points from 13 games, which is easily promotion form. We've got just under two weeks to get the Peretz deal ironed out, then things are going to start looking a lot better.

Never heard of the butterfly affect?

[Cabrone]

Tonda looks like a rabbit in the headlights and the players don't seem to give a toss but they are the symptoms, not the cause. Ultimately the buck stops with SR.

Ever since they have been at the club it's been downhill, the brief upturn with promotion just papered over the cracks.

Maybe we'll escape relegation this season but their utter incompetence will see us slide down the leagues. If they are telling the mgr how to set up the team then that says it all for me.

How far down is their level? L1\L2? Even lower? Can't see a turnaround while they are here.

[HnycS]

5 hours ago, Harry_SFC said:

He's an absolute shambles but let's not pretend this is all Bazunus fault. The tactics and the defending are both equally as culpable. The defender for all 4 goals is hilariously bad. 

Couldn't tell if it was bad or not, just couldn't figure out where the defenders were? Was it just me?

[Suhari]

1 hour ago, saintant said:

Never heard of the butterfly affect?

If a goalkeeper has wrists as strong as a cabbage-whites wings, he tends to save fuck all?

[Livewire]

I went to that travesty of a game today. We had five very good chances until the 55th minute, but don't let that fool you. We were still playing Russball out of the back with CBs and Manning who are singularly ill-suited to play that style, we were slow and ponderous and trying long balls up to Arma, who is barely taller than the grass. But that was nothing compared to the second half utter capitulation. At least I was able to leave on 75 minutes and beat the traffic. Cold comfort. Bazunu is poor, 5 at the back is a joke, we are too slow and too small. Leo's performance has also tailed off. All in all, avoiding relegation surely now has to be the aim - but I am not confident we can achieve it. 

[coalman]

“Not good enough,” Armstrong reflected. “I’ve touched on it before in a few interviews; first half we have to punish.

“That’s where we’re at; we need a bit of luck on our side at the minute and we have to go in front early doors. When you don’t do that in this league, you get punished.

“Second half was just flat. We didn’t come out going for them or anything, and then it’s a sloppy goal for the first one – a lack of communication, switching off, and their guy gets a free hit at goal. The way we reacted to that wasn’t good enough all over the pitch, myself included.

“It’s a tough one to take because we’ve had a lot of games come up recently, we’ve taken every game to the best of our ability to go and put it on to the pitch, but today we weren’t good enough. We have to go again.”

I see Armstrong is also pushing the not good enough after we conceded nonsense. A classic example of the Saints mindset right now. Pretend to take responsibility while bemoaning bad luck like we were on top in the first half rather than under self indicted siege. 

What does doing better look like Adam? It sounds like you're saying it wasn't good enough but we were unlucky and did our best. Make your mind up.

Also, saying you have to score first is just bollocks. You deal with what happens rather than shrugging and downing tools because something doesn't go your way. If you were captain why didn't you try, you know, captaining? The armband isn't just there to keep your fucking arm warm.

[trousers]

19 minutes ago, coalman said:

If you were captain why didn't you try, you know, captaining? The armband isn't just there to keep your fucking arm warm.

Indeed. I was looking out for his demeanor after each goal and, unless my eyes were deceiving me, each time he just sloped back to the half way line ready to kick off again. No geeing up or admonishing the players. The least we can do is give the armband to the one and only player that seems to care rather than the shrug-shoulders brigade... #scienza 

Edited Sunday at 23:45 by trousers

[Livewire]

7 hours ago, Suhari said:

Hats of to the fans who travelled up.

Hope you stay warm and have a safe and rapid trip home.

I left at 75 minutes, as I was driving from London. Doing so meant I beat the traffic and saved me probably 1 hour. I feel for those poor souls who are still on the coach on the way back. We should all get a refund. 

[HKsaint]

2 hours ago, Cabrone said:

Tonda looks like a rabbit in the headlights and the players don't seem to give a toss but they are the symptoms, not the cause. Ultimately the buck stops with SR.

Ever since they have been at the club it's been downhill, the brief upturn with promotion just papered over the cracks.

Maybe we'll escape relegation this season but their utter incompetence will see us slide down the leagues. If they are telling the mgr how to set up the team then that says it all for me.

How far down is their level? L1\L2? Even lower? Can't see a turnaround while they are here.

Don’t worry, Bazunu will drag us to where he belongs.

[SaintBobby]

That was dire. We are going to end up somewhere around 12th-14th. With the resources at our disposal, that is a complete, total and utter failure.

Tbh, squeaking into the play-offs in 6th place on goal difference would be - on any sensible metric - a very poor season indeed. And we look very unlikely to get close to even making that.

 

[SouSaint]

The players reaction to going 1 down was a disgrace. These players are a bunch of losers, I hate them. They have stank the place out for so long and still have some weird arrogance about them. I really hope the fans give them a piece of their minds for the Hull home game. 

Supporting this club has been a mostly dire experience since Zlatan scored the winner in the League Cup final. I think the current owners have well and truly killed any enthusiasm I had left for the club. It is rotten to the core and this isn't a quick or easy fix. We need rid of the majority of the players, they are shite and we need new owners. This isn't going to happen. 

This season is now about not getting dragged into a relegation battle but realistically we will lose our next three. Sport Republic can get fucked if they think I'm going to fork out another fortune on a season ticket next year. 

Tonda Eckhet Out. Sport Republic OUT. 

[SoberSaint]

Don’t know where to start, so I won’t.

Except to say that I just said to my wife (who doesn’t really do football) ‘our current and previous managers are both 32 and neither have played the game’.

Sounds a bit nuts don’t it!

[Sarnia Cherie]

12 hours ago, Toussaint said:

It’s my suspicion that’s why we find it so difficult to appoint anyone, no self respecting manager is going to concede so much autonomy to the overlords. 

I think you have something here. To digress a little, my Chelsea supporting son (yes, I know, I blame his mother!) tells me Chelsea will follow this mindset when they replace Maresca. Liam Rosenior is the likely replacement. A yes man from their sister club Strasbourg. SR follow this thinking of appointing close to home and on the cheap.  It didn't work with Selles, it isn't working with Eckert but still they soldier on hoping for the best while Saints freefall towards the bottom of the league.

[Harry_SFC]

27 minutes ago, Sarnia Cherie said:

I think you have something here. To digress a little, my Chelsea supporting son (yes, I know, I blame his mother!) tells me Chelsea will follow this mindset when they replace Maresca. Liam Rosenior is the likely replacement. A yes man from their sister club Strasbourg. SR follow this thinking of appointing close to home and on the cheap.  It didn't work with Selles, it isn't working with Eckert but still they soldier on hoping for the best while Saints freefall towards the bottom of the league.

The change in title from first team manager to first team head coach speaks volumes.

Eckert is there to coach the side in training and during games and that's it. No questions asked.

[Appy]

8 hours ago, trousers said:

Indeed. I was looking out for his demeanor after each goal and, unless my eyes were deceiving me, each time he just sloped back to the half way line ready to kick off again. No geeing up or admonishing the players. The least we can do is give the armband to the one and only player that seems to care rather than the shrug-shoulders brigade... #scienza 

Yep, from the away end the only players I could see having a go at others were Harwood-Bellis (shock) and Quarshie

[Sarnia Cherie]

26 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

The change in title from first team manager to first team head coach speaks volumes.

Eckert is there to coach the side in training and during games and that's it. No questions asked.

There you have it. I read over the weekend that Amorin is not happy with being described as a coach when he reckons he's the manager. 

[SW11_Saint]

8 hours ago, HKsaint said:

Don’t worry, Bazunu will drag us to where he belongs.

🙄

[SW11_Saint]

14 minutes ago, Appy said:

Yep, from the away end the only players I could see having a go at others were Harwood-Bellis (shock) and Quarshie

THB should likely be captain. Not a lot to choose from though. Armstrong is the worst possible candidate. 

[Cuddles]

41 minutes ago, Harry_SFC said:

The change in title from first team manager to first team head coach speaks volumes.

Eckert is there to coach the side in training and during games and that's it. No questions asked.

So do we think this is all Spors' doing? Such a weird and damaging way to run a club.

[Saintinnot]

The only thing I saw Quarshie do was having a go at the Linesman and Ref after the 1st goal for not giving offside when it was actually him playing Whittaker inside 

[obelisk]

7 hours ago, SaintBobby said:

That was dire. We are going to end up somewhere around 12th-14th. With the resources at our disposal, that is a complete, total and utter failure.

Tbh, squeaking into the play-offs in 6th place on goal difference would be - on any sensible metric - a very poor season indeed. And we look very unlikely to get close to even making that.

 

12th-14th seems pretty optimistic to me. On current form we're likely to be in a perilous situation after the expected surrender at Fratton Park.

[DT]

Ankerson is the turd we cannot flush away, dragging the club down with his 'out of the box' thinking. We are redefining football, guys. Everyone else has it wrong. We need managers who haven't managed, goalkeepers who can't keep goal, and strikers who can't score goals. Oh, and defenders who can't defend. Voila. Sports Republic's genius game plan, with Rasmus Twat as the key puppet string puller, managing the team via Teams.

Please go, SR.

[BARCELONASAINT]

I honestly don't think anyone is seriously surprised by the thumping yesterday, it has been a long time coming and someone was eventually going to take their chances against us.

I said at halftime yesterday we were so open and so it continued in the second half. It is easy to pick on one player and lay all the blame at his feet but this just is not correct.

The issues start in midfield, we give the ball away far too much, Flynn Downs is so guilty of this. Our defence is absolutely all over the place, how the fuck does Ryan Manning get a game? Our CB's are weak, THB, Statue JS just spend games bitching, Wood after last seasons exploits has been so disappointing, Fellows is not a wing back, just wtf is going on with playing players out of position? 

In possession we give the ball away to easily and in defence we absolutely fail to do the basics.

I personally think TE is in danger of destroying SCienza's confidence with his bizzare subs and asking him to play inside so much.

Anyone with any sense knows this season is gone and if we are not careful we will be looking anxiously over our shoulders!

[Convict Colony]

29 minutes ago, BARCELONASAINT said:

I honestly don't think anyone is seriously surprised by the thumping yesterday, it has been a long time coming and someone was eventually going to take their chances against us.

I said at halftime yesterday we were so open and so it continued in the second half. It is easy to pick on one player and lay all the blame at his feet but this just is not correct.

The issues start in midfield, we give the ball away far too much, Flynn Downs is so guilty of this. Our defence is absolutely all over the place, how the fuck does Ryan Manning get a game? Our CB's are weak, THB, Statue JS just spend games bitching, Wood after last seasons exploits has been so disappointing, Fellows is not a wing back, just wtf is going on with playing players out of position? 

In possession we give the ball away to easily and in defence we absolutely fail to do the basics.

I personally think TE is in danger of destroying SCienza's confidence with his bizzare subs and asking him to play inside so much.

Anyone with any sense knows this season is gone and if we are not careful we will be looking anxiously over our shoulders!

agree with all of this especially making leo worse and asking fellows to be a wing back.

3 CBs does not make us solid so lets try plan b - 4-2-3-1

Jelert and Wellington in 

[Andy Hill]

Just seen the highlights - how can 3 centre backs be so static and why can we not stop any crosses coming in ?? Need to sack the lot of them.

[tdmickey3]

40 minutes ago, Andy Hill said:

Just seen the highlights - how can 3 centre backs be so static and why can we not stop any crosses coming in ?? Need to sack the lot of them.

Piss poor coaching

[S-Clarke]

8 minutes ago, tdmickey3 said:

Piss poor coaching

They were missing Jack Stephens voice and organisational skills.

[coalman]

49 minutes ago, Andy Hill said:

Just seen the highlights - how can 3 centre backs be so static and why can we not stop any crosses coming in ?? Need to sack the lot of them.

They practice defending crosses against Adam Armstrong, Damien Downs and Cameron Archer. Two of whom don't score headers.

[tdmickey3]

1 minute ago, S-Clarke said:

They were missing Jack Stephens voice and organisational skills.

I think he has passed his special talent to them TBF...

Ball Watching

[tdmickey3]

1 minute ago, coalman said:

They practice defending crosses against Adam Armstrong, Damien Downs and Cameron Archer. Two of whom don't score headers.

I expect you are spot on

[lumuah]

4 minutes ago, coalman said:

They practice defending crosses against Adam Armstrong, Damien Downs and Cameron Archer. Two of whom don't score headers, and one who isn't a footballer.

Amended.

[saintant]

Presume the poor wee lambs have been rewarded with a day off in the warm today after their sterling efforts in the baltic North East yesterday. Well deserved. Meanwhile those earning way less who travelled to support said wee lambs will have got home late yesterday then had to haul themselves from their beds early this morning in freezing temperatures to earn a crust. Doesn't seem right somehow. 

[saintant]

Here's a question - how can a Championship team who train regularly and receive coaching from 'experts' have 8 or 9 players defending in their penalty area yet not one of them is marking an opponent? If anyone has a sensible answer I'd love to hear it. Baffling.

[skintsaint]

What a pile of wank, luckily have been busy the last 48 hours.....

So glad i was gifted a ticket for the Hull game soon...

[VectisSaint]

4 hours ago, Andy Hill said:

Just seen the highlights - how can 3 centre backs be so static and why can we not stop any crosses coming in ?? Need to sack the lot of them.

Stopping crosses is not the fault of the CBs, it is the result of having a useless LB and a non-existent RB. In a similar way much of the passing across the back is not always the fault of the CBs, but because certain players first thought always is to pass back to the back three, and strangely our LB is one of the prime examples of this, together in my opinion with Downes. Yes the CBs are useless collectively, but not all of their uselessness is directly down to them, there are other problems that need to be addressed.

[Dr Who?]

2 hours ago, skintsaint said:

What a pile of wank, luckily have been busy the last 48 hours.....

So glad i was gifted a ticket for the Hull game soon...

Might get a point! 

[Hussar Saint]

10 hours ago, SoberSaint said:

Don’t know where to start, so I won’t.

Except to say that I just said to my wife (who doesn’t really do football) ‘our current and previous managers are both 32 and neither have played the game’.

Sounds a bit nuts don’t it!

Jesus.....when you put it like that its pretty sobering! (pun intended)

[Oldandtired]

7 hours ago, saintant said:

Here's a question - how can a Championship team who train regularly and receive coaching from 'experts' have 8 or 9 players defending in their penalty area yet not one of them is marking an opponent? If anyone has a sensible answer I'd love to hear it. Baffling.

Isn't that what they call zonal marking?

[Whitey Grandad]

8 minutes ago, Oldandtired said:

Isn't that what they call zonal marking?

Our defenders are brilliant at finding space. 

[madge]

5 hours ago, VectisSaint said:

Stopping crosses is not the fault of the CBs, it is the result of having a useless LB and a non-existent RB. In a similar way much of the passing across the back is not always the fault of the CBs, but because certain players first thought always is to pass back to the back three, and strangely our LB is one of the prime examples of this, together in my opinion with Downes. Yes the CBs are useless collectively, but not all of their uselessness is directly down to them, there are other problems that need to be addressed.

We won’t stop crosses with a back 5 as the two full backs are high and wide when we lose the ball and opposing team find loads of space behind our full backs. Wouldn’t happen with a flat back 4. We also lose the midfield as we’re outnumbered. A manager paid thousands of pounds a week can’t see this when most others can. He’s a busted flush, opposing managers have worked us out and we have alternative methodology in play. It’s appalling that we’ve gone for a manager with so little in game management. 
sports republic are absolutely shambolic… need proper pressure on them now.

[saintant]

2 hours ago, Oldandtired said:

Isn't that what they call zonal marking?

I think you are right - another stupid tactic we seem to have adopted. Never seen a zone score a goal - unmarked players, yeah, plenty.