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Ronald Koeman Joins Everton - CONFIRMED

Jimmy_D

By Jimmy_D,
in The Saints

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doddisalegend

doddisalegend

Posted
Posted
All sounds a bit odd to me. Koeman is this big horrible dictator who the players hate, doesn't stick to club philosophies, goes off on holiday when he wants and we still want him to extend? Does that make any sense to anyone? Sounds like a bit of PR work to me.

 

 

I think there is element of club PR about all this because all our ITKs are getting their stuff from the club. Probably an element of truth to it all, as well, but it feels a little OTT. If it was bad as people are now making out I doubt the club would have even offered Koeman a new contract.

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way down south

way down south

Posted
Posted

Two things I struggle to understand in what schitt said,

1 if koeman did indeed veer off course and started to block the youth pathway to the first team, is it because he just doesn't know how to Develop youth talent (obv wasnt the case when he was in holland) or is it the more likely scenario in that the first team is just too good that unless the youth have spectacular talent they wont break into it?

2 is koeman that much of a harda** and a c*nt that he would humiliate a youngster infront of his mates when reed and some of the players have actually repeatedly said in interviews that koemans best trait is cool head in the face of adversity?

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Batman

Batman

Posted
Posted (edited)
Two things I struggle to understand in what schitt said,

1 if koeman did indeed veer off course and started to block the youth pathway to the first team, is it because he just doesn't know how to Develop youth talent (obv wasnt the case when he was in holland) or is it the more likely scenario in that the first team is just too good that unless the youth have spectacular talent they wont break into it?

2 is koeman that much of a harda** and a c*nt that he would humiliate a youngster infront of his mates when reed and some of the players have actually repeatedly said in interviews that koemans best trait is cool head in the face of adversity?

you have to appreciate that the vids and interviews from Reed/The club are pure spin. Not that it is a bad thing but it is what it is

Edited by Batman
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JoeShmoe

JoeShmoe

Posted
Posted
It's clearly only half the story, with plenty of face saving and reputation management thrown in.

 

Koeman will not be going on a year's gardening leave, that's for sure. Back from holiday and waving an Everton scarf about sometime before the end of the week.

 

And let's hope all the Everton players absolutely love him.

 

Because all these players hating him here seemed to be the fuel that drove us to sixth.

 

Agree with this, if everyone (including the board) were that concerned about him why was he offered the highest paid managerial job in our history? Sound like there is some truth in this but also some bu**s**t. Players in all clubs wont get on with certain managers

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Wade Garrett

Wade Garrett

Posted
Posted
Interesting read and I'm sure a lot of it has some truth, but struggle to believe how if Koeman is such a **** hated by so many at the club that he managed to coax such a great run of results from the players at the end of the season - W7 D1 L1 in last 9 games!

 

He didn't look hated when celebrating goals with the players, Liverpool, Palace. Considering the timing, I reckon it's a bit more spin.

 

This needs to be resolved quickly.

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SO16_Saint

SO16_Saint

Posted
Posted

Just seen this on a Facebook page. Not sure if this came from here? (1/2)

 

At the end of the season, Koeman verbally agreedto a new contract with Saints, even down to such details as what players would be leaving [Wanyama (most likely to Spurs), Pelle (most likely to Lazio), Juanmi (to Sociadad, already done) lol, I didn't even know he had gone! and Mane (most likely to Man. Utd)] -- as well as discussing our transfer targets into the Club. This was all verbally agreed upon, leaving the finer details of Ron's actual contract itself to be sorted by his agent and settled when he returned from [his first] holiday.Whilst he was away however, Everton approached Ronald's [now former] Agent, Guido Albers, to sound him out on Ronald's interest in taking up the Everton Job. His agent, taking Ronald at his word - "I like to honour my contract, I like to stay at Saints" - [bear in mind that the agent had been involved in negotiating Ronald's new Saints contract, and therefore believed that he wished to stay] flatly turned down the Everton approach on behalf of Ronald, and instead put forward the name of another of his clients, Frank De Boer, who was indeed interested in the Everton job. [Two agent pay-days for the price of one!] Everton, having already been turned down by their first choice, Unai Emery from Sevilla [who is off to PSG] were determined to get their second choice [Ronald Koeman] -- and so used Dutch agent Rob Jansen to approach Ronald with an "offer he could not refuse" -- i.e. £6-7 mill a year, and £100m transfer kitty to splash. Ronald was furious that his own agent [Albers] had refused the offer without even speaking to him first, and sacked him, taking on Rob Jansen in his place. And here is where things get interesting.Koeman was not entirely dishonest -- as he wasn't really that interested in the Everton job. Who wouldbe, when you've just got your team into European football for the second year running, already enjoy substantial backing from your board, the adoration of your loyal fan-base -- and Everton are nowhere? But what Koeman wanted to do, was to use this interest and concrete offer as a bargaining tool when he returned from his holiday, to say to the Saints Board "this is the kind of 'ambition' I am talking about". He wanted to "use" the Everton interest to get himself more spending money with Saints -- but he grossly overestimated his own "value" to the Saints Board.

 

For quite a while now -- Saints have not been entirely happy with Koeman. Many of the agreements he had previously made when he first signed, he had not been honouring. The style of football, formation, and most importantly -- the much vaunted "pathway" to the First Team from our famed Academy -- which under Ronald has been said inside the Club to have become "blocked". His attitude toward our young players, never bothering to involve himself with the Academy or even watch their games [he sees himself very much as a "First Team Manager only" whereas we want our manager to take a keen interest in helping develop our burgeoning talent], often discouraging them, blankly stating that most of them are simply not good enough, and at one point launching into a very nasty tirade of abuse to young Matty Targett, that is said to have stunned those who were there in its cutting spitefulness and completely unnecessary severity. The "esteemed" Ronald Koeman callously tore a sensitive young lad to shreds in front of all his mates, and has since been widely regarded as a complete ****.Ronald Koeman, despite his very well presented and controlled public image in the media, is not particularly well liked by many at the Club, to make a sweeping understatement. His aloofness and arrogance on the training ground, his unapproachability, and tendency to snap at players and speak to them in a disrespectful tone has not gone down well. Mane, JWP, Harry Reed, and Tadic in particular have an immense dislike of Ronald Koeman, and others only tolerate his tactless approach as they're regularly in the Team, were enjoying an element of success under him, and don't want to rock the boat. But you get the general idea.

 

We are also greatly peturbed at some of Ronald's training methods, i.e the lack and short duration of them, the low intensity, and lack of commitment to training in general. He gives the players a lot of time off, and is prone to "disappearing on golfing breaks"

when we feel that he should be spending his time coaching our players!

 

The Board have been questioning a lot about his management style and not honouring his commitments to playing "The Southampton Way" and his stifling of the pathway for our young players for a while now -- but whilst he has been enjoying success and has the firm backing of the fans, they have been loathe to take any firm course of action. Ronald got very lucky during our disasterous run of form over the Christmas period, where we lost seven out of nine games, and we were persisting in that horrendous hoofball style of football, lumping long balls up to a woefully out of form [yet constantly picked anyway] Pelle, and privately among the Board, questions were being asked by some, of whether to get rid of Koeman then. But as I say, he got lucky: Pelle got injured, and Ronald was forced to play the excellent Shane Long [who he previously never game a proper chance to show his qualities], and change back to a style of play more suited to our philosophy. Shlong pretty much saved Koeman's job at that time.So that's the background. Ron thought his "gravitas" in the game deserved a certain respect, and coupled with the success he has brought us -- he badly misjudged his importance to our Board. He thought he could use the Everton interest, believing his value and position at the Club to be unassailable -- to effectively blackmail the Board into agreeing completely to his own terms to sign a new deal. It wasn't so much about the personal money on offer, but more with getting more to spend on new players than was on offer -- and forcing Sadio Mane to stay again against his will. Sadio hates Koeman [the phrase used (by Sadio) was "****ing arrogant asshat"], and the irony is, we now have a higher likelihood of keeping him [Mane], without Koeman around. Not to say that will definitely happen, just that it might.

 

Koeman gave us an ultimatum, that we could either make him an offer much closer to what Everton were offering -- or he would simply not sign the new deal, and see out the last year of his contract as promised. This effectively massively backfired on him, as our Board were really not that fussed. We have other excellent candidates on our shortlist who we feel would stick much more closely to our Club philosophies, and therefore be a better fit with the Club -- and as stated -- many players who'd be happy to see the back of him.So the Saints Board effectively called his bluff, and said sorry Ron -- either you sign the deal you've already verbally agreed to -- or you can take the Everton job and we'll get in someone who will do things the way we want, according to our Club philosophy. What we won't have, is a "lame duck" manager seeing out the last year of his contract, when what we want, is for someone committed to our new Five-Year Plan and hungry to build on what we've already achieved. Ronald simply wasn't showing the kind of commitment we were looking for, so we gave him the choice to either do so, or **** off to Everton. Lol.We gave him two weeks to decide what to do; sign the new contract, or go **** himself. Ron stormed off in a huff on holiday number two after this, and we shall await the final outcome. It is not beyond the realms of possibility that he yet may end up staying, so don't burn any effigies just yet -- although to be honest -- I suspect that bridge has now been burnt sufficiently from both ends to be unlikely in the extreme. Though, stranger things have happened -- like Ronald Koeman being interested in a club like Everton for example, lol. And this is why the whole sorry saga has been playing out now for so long. Ronald doesn't reallywant the Everton job -- but his own duplicitous conduct has ended up forcing him down a path he was entirely not expecting! He badly misjudged the situation and his own worth to the Club -- and thought that we would bend to his will, to keep such an esteemed figure at the Club at all costs. And now -- if he doesn't take the Everton job -- he looks like a complete ****, as he [almost certainly] won't be staying at Saints. Well, he looks like a complete **** either way now, whatever he does, lol.He's completely blown the reputation he carefully established for integrity, decency, and being a man of honour and respect.

Another thing, is that we will not budge on the finer details of his compensation package with Everton. Some of which (including guarantees that they will not make offers for any Southampton players once Koeman arrives) are proving to be a real sticking point, as is the contract on offer to his brother Erwin, and the fact that both Erwin and particularly Jan Kluitenberg (our fitness coach) are ****ed off at Ronald, as they both love being at Saints, and didn't want to leave. Erwin, ultimately, will be loyal to Ron -- but Jan (and his family) really love living in the area, have settled really well here and don't particularly want to leave. (He may yet even end up staying). If Everton do not agree to absolutely everything that Saints want -- we are quite happy to deny Everton permission to take our under contract manager, and essentially "hang him out to dry" for a year whilst his contract runs down, and we'll get on and appoint someone who does want to commit to us fully.

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SO16_Saint

SO16_Saint

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2/2:

 

Moving on to that now -- and some details of our shortlist:Most of the names in the press are not our preferred targets. Don't worry at some of the horriffic options that have been bandied around. The likes of Moyes and McClaren are nowhere near consideration. I've heard Pellegrini linked in the media, and he is on our list, but only as an albeit very decent back up option if we don't get one of our preferred candidates. Eddie Howe I've also seen linked, he is on our long-term watch list of potential managers that is constantly updated, and Les Reed in particular is a big fan -- but overall we don't feel that he yet has the required level of experience or "gravitas" to impress our Europe-bound Squad or the names we're looking to bring into the Club. Frank De Boer has also been linked everywhere, and is on our list -- but some way down the pecking order, as we prefer someone with experience and evidence of implementing their philosophy across a range of Clubs to show consistency in application, whereas Frank has so far only managed at Ajax.My friend [indicated to the existence of, but] will not reveal the names - of two of our most favoured options at the top of the list, as they do not want to risk alerting other Clubs to the possibility of their availabilty, but other than those, I can say that Murat Yakin [currently out of contract after parting ways with Spartak Moscow] Vitor Pereira [of Fenerbahçe], Paco Jémez [of Rayo Vallecano] are all managers who are thought of very highly by the Club, sharing in our philosophy and playing the brand of football we like, and have long been on our watch-list. So if we don't get one of our two unrevealed names, those three are high on our appreciated list. So too very much is Thomas Tuchel, but the fact he's only just recently replaced Jurgen Klopp at Dortmund crosses him off of our potential targets for now, [he's unlikely to be interested].

 

And that is about all I have for now. But suffice to say, that if Koeman does eventually end up at Everton -- it is only because we have succeeded in getting everything that we want from Everton in order to release him from his contract. Otherwise, enjoy a year of downtime Ron -- and just think of all the holidays and golfing opportunities you'll be able to partake of!

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simo

simo

Posted
Posted
That's just been lifted from here in the main, pieced together and composed as an ITK story and wherever there's a gap, filled in with the most commonly held view. That's not ITK, that's pure supposition.

 

Exactly my thoughts , nothing we haven't heard over the last few months just pieced together into one post!

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beatlesaint

beatlesaint

Posted
Posted
That's just been lifted from here in the main, pieced together and composed as an ITK story and wherever there's a gap, filled in with the most commonly held view. That's not ITK, that's pure supposition.

 

in your opinion, you don't know that for sure unless you know the guy who wrote it originally.

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bubblyone

bubblyone

Posted
Posted
Interesting. On the surface very comprehensive and rich with detail.

 

Not sure what to make of that myself. ITKers generally only present snippets since (i) they only have one source who's unlikely to be informed of the whole picture themselves and (ii) information is selectively given, not shared on request. In particular, it rarely forms a nice neat narrative that uncannily answers all supporters burning questions.

Agree totally

It's believable in the same way the JFK theories are.

Doesn't mean it's true but " I would love it if...."

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Fitzhugh Fella

Fitzhugh Fella

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Posted

I am pretty sure JS's post is pretty spot on at least as far as the club sees it as a couple of things tally exactly to what I have heard. I would also add I am 99% certain that this post originated directly from the club. With Koeman back tomorrow the release of all this info - which adds up pretty much - is perfect timing. Tomorrow or Tuesday will be interesting!

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Nolan

Nolan

Posted
Posted
I am pretty sure JS's post is pretty spot on at least as far as the club sees it as a couple of things tally exactly to what I have heard. I would also add I am 99% certain that this post originated directly from the club. With Koeman back tomorrow the release of all this info - which adds up pretty much - is perfect timing. Tomorrow or Tuesday will be interesting!

 

And with Adam Blackmore tweeting this after reading the story "@sotonians that pretty much nails it for me - concurs with all I have, know & thought".

 

It's difficult to not concede that this is now the truth.

 

Wether it is the truth in the future is anybodys guess.

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buctootim

buctootim

Posted
Posted
You knew Mane used 'ar sehat' as an insult. Link please

 

tbf thats one of the least credible bits. If you've ever seen him in an interview colloquialisms like that just dont fit with him, someone who speaks English as a fourth language. 'Chapeau cul' maybe

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
And with Adam Blackmore tweeting this after reading the story "@sotonians that pretty much nails it for me - concurs with all I have, know & thought".

 

It's difficult to not concede that this is now the truth.

 

Wether it is the truth in the future is anybodys guess.

"The truth" as in "this is what various people/one person inside the club is feeding out as the club's version of events".

 

Or, half the truth.

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CB Saint

CB Saint

Posted
Posted
tbf thats one of the least credible bits. If you've ever seen him in an interview colloquialisms like that just dont fit with him, someone who speaks English as a fourth language. 'Chapeau cul' maybe

 

I don't know, one of the first things you learn in a foreign country is a comprehensive arsenal of swear words

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Fitzhugh Fella

Fitzhugh Fella

Posted
Posted
"The truth" as in "this is what various people/one person inside the club is feeding out as the club's version of events".

 

Or, half the truth.

Well we all know there are two sides to every story but Even as a cynic I am inclined to side with the club's version. RK changing agents at a crucial time was strange but now I can see why if you take this explanation at face value.

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whelk

whelk

Posted
Posted
tbf thats one of the least credible bits. If you've ever seen him in an interview colloquialisms like that just dont fit with him, someone who speaks English as a fourth language. 'Chapeau cul' maybe

 

Always preferred 'ar sehead' myself. Probably Bladkadder influenced as in 'what a complete ar se head'

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mulletsaint

mulletsaint

Posted
Posted
That's just been lifted from here in the main, pieced together and composed as an ITK story and wherever there's a gap, filled in with the most commonly held view. That's not ITK, that's pure supposition.

 

Not surprising you say that, given your well known view of those running the club. Not saying you couldn't be right, although some info I got today backs some of it up, including the Sammy Lee thing.

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Ludwig

Ludwig

Posted
Posted
That's just been lifted from here in the main, pieced together and composed as an ITK story and wherever there's a gap, filled in with the most commonly held view. That's not ITK, that's pure supposition.

 

 

LOL, we all remember your ITK. Quality that was.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted (edited)
Well we all know there are two sides to every story but Even as a cynic I am inclined to side with the club's version. RK changing agents at a crucial time was strange but now I can see why if you take this explanation at face value.

Changed agents because he saw an opportunity to make a mint at a new club and therefore leave Saints. Not because of this odd convolution that he didn't really want to leave.

 

This is all eerily similar to the ITK solid gold from two summers ago when we were supposed to believe that Adam Lallana was sent running heartbroken into the arms of Liverpool because Les Reed didn't return his phone call.

 

The stuff about Ron being so awfully terrible to the players is probably true but you'll get a story like that at every club in the land and it is utterly irrelevant.

 

He tore some players off a strip and we went on a spectacular run in and finished sixth. As far as I'm concerned Ron or any future manager can do that again and again.

 

Matt Targett is a 20 year old adult and supposed to be an elite footballer. He needs to be able to take a bo llocking as part of the job.

 

Anyway, read as the whole, this entire ITK dispatch reads as "he never wanted to leave me, and anyway I don't want him any more, I've moved on" is the kind of face-saving cover story used on the fire escapes of night clubs by blubbing girls in heels every Saturday night up and down the country.

 

Great gossip though.

Edited by CB Fry
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Doctoroncall

Doctoroncall

Posted
Posted
I am pretty sure JS's post is pretty spot on at least as far as the club sees it as a couple of things tally exactly to what I have heard. I would also add I am 99% certain that this post originated directly from the club. With Koeman back tomorrow the release of all this info - which adds up pretty much - is perfect timing. Tomorrow or Tuesday will be interesting!

 

Hey FF, do you know if Ron was like this all through his tenure or some of it, i.e. the short training sessions, time-off and not interested in the youth side?

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Ohio Saint

Ohio Saint

Posted
Posted

Like RK, I would also take a doubling of my wage to go to another job. Unlike RK, nobody would care if I did!.....However, in the unlikely circumstance that anyone actually cared about me leaving, I would have to accept the animosity of those I left behind. So, in that spirit, he can eat crap and go to hell.

 

Being a footy fan is all about passion, if I can't bear a grudge or get annoyed about anything I choose, then I may as well become a yoga fan instead.

 

I hope he fails miserably at No. 2 bindippers......Just because.....

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Fitzhugh Fella

Fitzhugh Fella

Posted
Posted
Hey FF, do you know if Ron was like this all through his tenure or some of it, i.e. the short training sessions, time-off and not interested in the youth side?

 

No I must admit the negative stories about RK only really started around the time of our mid-season slump. I was aware he had a degree of apathy towards the Academy but as Terry Paine told me that was always the Barca way of doing things ie the first team players were always kept aloof and apart. I assumed RK was just following this tradition having been schooled in the Barca way. I was aware that this was not in keeping with the club's overall strategy and was causing tension.

I think what we have all read today is the club's version of events and it suits their purpose. I am sure Koeman would tell another story and as CB Fry points out in a result driven business Koeman has delivered.

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Saint IQ

Saint IQ

Posted
Posted

So funny reading Evertons forum only did it today, nearly all of them are so sure that us selling players and improving is just luck, we can go no further and will probably go down etc..Then they're jizzing over the prospect over getting Monchi as he's so good at was he does, ie buying players for not that much and selling them on for a huge price just like we have been doing. 99% of them unbelievably thick and deluded

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