Any love for Redmond?

[whelk]

From my WhatsApp, Twitter and here, and of course what saw with my own eyes, there must be consensus that he is woeful and shouldn’t be in the team?

Is there anyone who thinks he should start? All the love in here for Ralph but cannot recall any player being so universally unpopular and shit with only the manager being blinded to what is clear to everyone else..

[Fan The Flames]

I don't think he is as bad as he is made out to be.

[DT]

Can’t stand him. Awful. Ruins most of our forward momentum by losing the ball. No end product.  Can’t shoot. Clearly rates himself. Should be nowhere near the first team. 

Edited 2 March, 2021 by DT

[Nemi]

To be fair was his off-the-ball movement that created the Djenepo  chance

[WALK DMC]

34 minutes ago, whelk said:

From my WhatsApp, Twitter and here, and of course what saw with my own eyes, there must be consensus that he is woeful and shouldn’t be in the team?

Is there anyone who thinks he should start? All the love in here for Ralph but cannot recall any player being so universally unpopular and shit with only the manager being blinded to what is clear to everyone else..

I can't defend his performance last night, it was awful. I do think that he is a better player than the one we saw yesterday, but he needs to be dropped (for his own good) and somehow to try and get his confidence back. In my view he will never be a top player, but he can make a contribution when he is on song - but I do recognise that has been a while since that has consistently happened. 

[Baird of the land]

I've appreciated what he previously offered to the team even if he could be frustrating. However right now he is offering none of that, encapsulated by last night's display. Bench him and if he makes an impact from it to earn a recall fine.

[Turkish]

He is the image of this team. A total confidence player, when things are going well for him he can be decent, where they're not he's poor. He was dreadful last night, pretty much every time he got the ball he gave it away, he should be one of those you'd look to make things happen but is just a nothing player at the moment. Tella has had more impact in the short time he's featured than Redmond has in this bad run. 

[Saint_lambden]

He's played over 150 games for us and at 26 should at the peak of his career but is instead getting worse. Probably had about 20 good games since he's joined. I know he's a confidence player but his complete inability to take anyone on when he's in this sort of form really limits us. 

No doubt he'll be along at the end of the season to do an interview saying how tough it's been like he did before. Truth is, his current form is the normal and any purple patch was a blip. 

[eurosaint]

I think he is in the team at the moment because there are very few alternatives  but for me, I'd play Tella who has been quite impressive in his recent appearances !

[qwertyell]

His confidence and body language has always been questionable - seems like he has a lot to say for himself on the pitch, but then cowers like a frightened kitten when he gets on the ball. 

I'm always surprised by how weak he is. Physically, he looks far more solid than, say, Djenepo, but he gets brushed aside so easily. Unlike Moussa, there's just no fight in him, no putting his body on the line for the team. He's a quitter.

You can put up with a frustrating player who keeps trying but failing to make things happen, but there's no future for one that stops trying.

Ability? Some. Character? Zilch. 

[Kingsbridge Saint]

In possession behaves like he's trying to manage a shopping trolley with a wobbly wheel. Last night was about as effective as an empty crisp packet blowing around Goodison. If we're a bit short on players, give a traffic cone a chance.

[Wurzel]

He is our nearly man.

Nearly times his runs correctly, but never quite there.

Nearly scores but it's too wide, too high, deflected, blocked.

Nearly takes on his man and beats him but only he or the ball gets past him, rarely both.

Nearly gets involved in a rapid fluid attacking move but turns around and goes backwards.

Nearly makes a killer pass but underhits or overhits it or picks the wrong man.

Nearly breaks up an opposition attack but only manages to jog alongside the player.  We used to play the "take it in turns to break up attacks with a middle-of-the-park foul" game, but he hardly ever picks up a yellow so doesn't even manage that.

And on the odd occasion tv cameras get him in close op he's nearly always complaining, whether at team mates or the ref we can't be sure.

He certainly showed the promise and ability  few years back but I can't remember a player of that age regress so badly (apart from injuries). Not sure if it's a total lack of confidence or lack of understanding of what's required of him. With our lack of squad strength it seems like if he's fit he plays at the moment but someone seriously needs to get inside his head and sort him out.

[warsash saint]

He set up our last goal!!

[UpweySaint]

Playing poorly and on current form should not be starting but then you could say the same for a fair few right now.

 

Reality is we don’t have a plethora of choices in the squad to replace him with. 
 

For me the frustration is I genuinely believe he is better than he has shown this season. The worst thing is peak redmond (admittedly we’ve not seen him for a while!) is exactly the sort of player we could do with to give us something extra in the final third. 
 

 

 

 

[OldNick]

He is one of my favourite players and have felt he has been treated badly by fans. Last night though I felt for his own good he should be taken out of the firing line.

He has the skill to beat players and frustrates me that he doesnt do it. Im not sure if he is following Ralphs instructions and that is holding him back. 

Anyway, it is tie he was taken out of the spotlight.

Bertrand gets away with a lot, the amount of times he has good crossing opportunities and wastes them.I wonder how many assists he has.

[sydney_saint]

He is not good enough. This isn't a nipper with room to improve, this is a (nearly) 27 year old with over 200 EPL appearances. This is him. If you take a look at our key forward players over the last five years, his output is comparatively terrible

Redmond- 11,841'- 19 goals, 13 assists

Armstrong- 4,886'- 11 goals, 8 assists

Che Adams - 3,020'- 8 goals, 7 assists

Danny Ings - 6,158' - 37 goals, 8 assists

Shane Long - 9,339' - 27 goals, 20 assists

Djenepo- 1,963' - 3 goals, 2 assists

Tadic- 9,617'- 21 goals, 30 assists

Charlie Auston- 3,157'- 16 goals, 3 assists

Gabbiadini- 2,271'- 10 goals, 0 assists

Obafemi- 813'- 4 goals, 3 assists

Boufal - 3,072' - 3 goals, 4 assists

He has one of the worst goals and assists ratios out of all of them, and miles behind alot of them. No player has had more chances in our side than Redmond. And whilst I know football is more than goals and assists, we also know it is hardly like Redmond is cutting teams open and causing havoc and creating chances. Yes he had a purple patch once before. But if you give most Championship players 150+ appearances in the Premier League they too will have a purple patch at some stage. 

I'm not even convinced he works that hard. In the first half against Leeds for example, there were two opportunities in 5 minutes to put them under serious pressure. One where the ball was bobbing around in their box. Did he a) sprint and chase them down to force a mistake or b) amble towards him and allow them to clear easily. A few minutes later he didn't close down in middle of pitch and Vestegaard ended up getting booked.

Compare that with the fight and desire from Djenepo. Yeah we are all still not sure if Djenepo will be good enough, but there is no doubt the kid is putting his heart into everything. Watch Tella sprint across to close down players. 

What annoys me most though is that redmond didn't earn his way back into the side. He was injured for a few games and then appeared back in the starting line up despite doing very little from the bench (apart from scoring a third against a shit Sheffield United side with the game wrapped up). If he wants to start games, make him earn it. 

 

[Toussaint]

1 hour ago, Nemi said:

To be fair was his off-the-ball movement that created the Djenepo  chance

Are you sure he wasn't taking up a position where he couldn't receive the ball where he would have to take some responsibility? Because he does that an awful lot, I can only assume his confidence is completely shot.

Edited 2 March, 2021 by Toussaint
gobbledygook, not much better after edit

[saint1977]

41 minutes ago, UpweySaint said:

Playing poorly and on current form should not be starting but then you could say the same for a fair few right now.

 

Reality is we don’t have a plethora of choices in the squad to replace him with. 
 

For me the frustration is I genuinely believe he is better than he has shown this season. The worst thing is peak redmond (admittedly we’ve not seen him for a while!) is exactly the sort of player we could do with to give us something extra in the final third. 
 

 

 

 

Good post. Nathan does need be taken out of the firing line and historically would have been. Until we get the takeover we badly need then it's hard to see how he can't be in at least the match day squad. Tella has to be given a go at Sheffield but not without risk. I think Moussa actually offers what an on-form Redmond does, a bit more unpredictable but if we go with a three of JWP/Stu/Diallo (if fit to start) it offers him some cover to take more risks and commit defenders. I'd be playing him last season's winner up there all week on video just to remind him.

It might fire Nathan up as well being dropped, bar City we've now got some equally poor sides to play so we can afford to be more offensive in approach. 

Nathan has been poor all season, but Adams needs mentioning as even if he isn't scoring, his movement is a fraction of what it can be at present. Unlike Danny he can't afford to be 80%, needs to be running his socks off and competing like he was March-January. If Che's not making regular runs to the far or back post, everyone moans at Bertrand but what does he honestly have to aim at if he crosses early? Berty will be better once KWP is back so we have two outlets again. 

[Ed Rooney]

Offers nothing at all, it’s like playing with 10 every week 

[JRM]

1 hour ago, qwertyell said:

His confidence and body language has always been questionable - seems like he has a lot to say for himself on the pitch, but then cowers like a frightened kitten when he gets on the ball. 

I'm always surprised by how weak he is. Physically, he looks far more solid than, say, Djenepo, but he gets brushed aside so easily. Unlike Moussa, there's just no fight in him, no putting his body on the line for the team. He's a quitter.

You can put up with a frustrating player who keeps trying but failing to make things happen, but there's no future for one that stops trying.

Ability? Some. Character? Zilch. 

I think you're right, it's sad to see but mentally he has no appetite for a battle or to prove people wrong, he looks like if he's criticised for being shit he'd just shrug his shoulders and say yeah I know. 

Get him a couple of games in the u23s, a chance to just enjoy playing with no pressure then bring him back after the international break. 

[Hatch]

Would struggle to get a regular game for  those pricks down the road,  so should be nowhere near our first team

[Greenridge]

2 hours ago, Nemi said:

To be fair was his off-the-ball movement that created the Djenepo  chance

Sums him up. Better no where near the ball. Or pitch. (OK maybe the last bit was a tad harsh...but maybe not)

[Lord Duckhunter]

He has been awful lately, but he’s not as bad as some make out. Just like dropping Jack Stephen’s didn’t make our defending particularly better, dropping him won’t make us suddenly start banging then in left right and centre. He’s average, soft as shite, and mentally weak, pretty much like the rest of them. The only difference is others get a free pass for it. 

[S-Clarke]

Very little I think.

Thought we had something in 2018/2019, but he's got worse again. Maybe that season was just a purple patch. Although he wasn't great every game that year (we were still pretty shit), he was our most threatening player.

He's always been risk adverse for me, slows the game down to make a safe pass backwards or sideways. He seems to prefer that than taking a risk and attacking a defender. I'm not sure if that's confidence or his complete technical limitations as a modern winger. Maybe a bit of both.

What's happening now is that even his risk adverse approach (backwards/sideways) has gone tits up, as he keeps putting us in shit situations with a pass back. He needs to be out of the team for a period of time. We're better without him in it.

 

[John Boy Saint]

4 hours ago, warsash saint said:

He set up our last goal!!

"One Swallow doesn't make a Summer", springs to mind at that.

Edited 2 March, 2021 by John Boy Saint

[Teddeer]

23 minutes ago, John Boy Saint said:

"One Swallow doesn't make a Summer", springs at that.

If you could only have squeezed 'winter' in you'd have had the full set. 

[Viking Saint]

6 hours ago, Fan The Flames said:

I don't think he is as bad as he is made out to be.

Agree, he's worse

[Lee On Solent Saint]

Have we had a decent winger since Rod Wallace?

[Edmonton Saint]

Newcastle away was my final straw with Redmond. Our pathetic attempts at breaking down 9 men seemed to end with Redmond’s contributions. One player who I hope we can move on as he’s been a big part of the malaise encompassing this team.

[trousers]

 

[notnowcato]

6 hours ago, Nemi said:

To be fair was his off-the-ball movement that created the Djenepo  chance

I was going to say the same..  the shit Nathan would've got on here if he'd matched Djenepo's attempt.   

[notnowcato]

4 hours ago, sydney_saint said:

 

Tadic- 9,617'- 21 goals, 30 assists

 

 

Another fans favourite..

[jampot]

Reminds me of George Lawrence...

[Mystic Force]

A Confidence player is not who I want to be relying on to end a slump in form.

I first watched Redmond against us when he was with Norwich. The commentators bigged up his skill so I watched with Intrigue, only to see someone fail to really do anything much with the ball. But he was young and up and coming. Saw Norwich a couple more times that season and watched him flatter to deceive. So when we bought him, I was not exactly excited. A player who looks like they could do something but never really did. He carried on in the same vein initially, then hit a patch where he looked decent in a sea of mediocrity. Then has reverted to the mean in more recent times. With this record he is hardly the player to turn it around. Any pace he had will likely have been reduced by aging and injuries, so will not have that in his locker so I am just waiting for his inevitable replacement.

My biggest problem with him is that while watching on my phone at work his shinny bald head was easily confused with Djenpo dyed white hair which made me excited to see him on the ball as he is the only one who seems to be able to make anything happen (before the opposition inevitably scythe him down knowing he is our only real creative threat) only to see the more zoomed in shot, realize it was Redmond after all, and watch him inevitably give it back to the opposition.

[notnowcato]

14 minutes ago, jampot said:

Reminds me of George Lawrence...

Very different types of players... unless you are referring to the "support" George received. 

[Sheaf Saint]

5 hours ago, warsash saint said:

He set up our last goal!!

With a simple pass to feet under no pressure.

It was the Chelsea CBs who made that goal, by leaving Mino in too much space, not Redmond.

 

[notnowcato]

3 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

With a simple pass to feet under no pressure.

It was the Chelsea CBs who made that goal, by leaving Mino in too much space, not Redmond.

 

Or... it was a line breaking pass beyond Kante splitting the Chelsea defence in half with the perfect weight for Mina to run on to.

The goal was made on the training pitch, Ralph's post match interview said as much.

[Sheaf Saint]

2 minutes ago, notnowcato said:

Or... it was a line breaking pass beyond Kante splitting the Chelsea defence in half with the perfect weight for Mina to run on to.

The goal was made on the training pitch, Ralph's post match interview said as much.

It wasn't weighted for Mina to run onto. It was a straight pass to feet, and Mina's first touch was excellent and enabled him to create the chance for himself.

[notnowcato]

5 minutes ago, Sheaf Saint said:

It wasn't weighted for Mina to run onto. It was a straight pass to feet, and Mina's first touch was excellent and enabled him to create the chance for himself.

It's a great pass between Kante and Rudiger.  When you see that pass from behind the goal I think you can appreciate it more.  Mina didn't break stride, took a fantastic first touch and then finished superbly. 

[beatlesaint]

Since the end of lockdown 1 back in June he has been bloody awful, varying degrees of awful, but awful none the same. The constant arm waving, pointing to others and generally trying to blame his team mates for his bad touch, bad decision, abysmal shot is, in my mind, shithousery at its worst. 
 

He is typical of the shrinking violet mentality this group of players has. First half against Leeds he popped up and fucked up here and there, second half when the wheels fell of I thought I had missed Ralph taking him off, totally anonymous. 

[East Kent Saint]

4 minutes ago, beatlesaint said:

Since the end of lockdown 1 back in June he has been bloody awful, varying degrees of awful, but awful none the same. The constant arm waving, pointing to others and generally trying to blame his team mates for his bad touch, bad decision, abysmal shot is, in my mind, shithousery at its worst. 
 

He is typical of the shrinking violet mentality this group of players has. First half against Leeds he popped up and fucked up here and there, second half when the wheels fell of I thought I had missed Ralph taking him off, totally anonymous. 

Typical maybe of a player who wants to do well but nothing comes off so vents his frustration on his team mates . Saints need some quality players to drag the youngsters up a level .

[Appy]

1 hour ago, trousers said:

 

That was two seasons ago, he’s done nothing since. 
 

 

Just because he won player of the year a few years ago he shouldn’t get a free pass. 

[trousers]

7 minutes ago, Appy said:

Just because he won player of the year a few years ago he shouldn’t get a free pass. 

Don't think anyone is saying he should?

Edited 2 March, 2021 by trousers

[rooney]

He does not seem to like going in for a tackle, always hoping the opposing player gets there first.

[davefizzy14]

Yes Redders looks a bit low in confidence but my god he doesn't need people slating him and getting on his back. I trust Ralph to take him out of the firing line and introduce him from the bench for a few games. He has quality as typified with that sublime pass through to Minamino against Chelsea. 

[miserableoldgit]

I have to be honest. I have been trying to give him the benefit of the doubt. He obviously isn't a natural finisher but I thought that when he played a bit deeper he was more effective although, of course, not world beating. Last night however, he was just dreadful. Could keep the ball, and his passing was uniformly awful. Not sure how many more chances he gets....

[verlaine1979]

6 hours ago, S-Clarke said:

Very little I think.

Thought we had something in 2018/2019, but he's got worse again. Maybe that season was just a purple patch. Although he wasn't great every game that year (we were still pretty shit), he was our most threatening player.

He's always been risk adverse for me, slows the game down to make a safe pass backwards or sideways. He seems to prefer that than taking a risk and attacking a defender. I'm not sure if that's confidence or his complete technical limitations as a modern winger. Maybe a bit of both.

What's happening now is that even his risk adverse approach (backwards/sideways) has gone tits up, as he keeps putting us in shit situations with a pass back. He needs to be out of the team for a period of time. We're better without him in it.

 

His problem is that he knows his limitations and is very careful about playing within them. He's not fast and he's not tricky, so he never really tests himself in situations where he isn't odds on to win. He likes nothing more than an open lane in off the left where he can drift ten yards across defenders who don't want to give JWP a free kick opportunity and then spoon it over the bar from just outside the D.

This would only make him as irritating to watch as our other conservative types, but what makes Redmond stand out is that he demands the ball and moans when he doesn't get it like a player who genuinely makes a difference in games, rather than another tedious, recycling nonentity.

[RedWillie]

On his day he is very good, sadly his days are few and far between.  His confidence is shot, currently adds very little.

[Saintelsewhere]

I think the best way to describe his football is:  Cowardly.

His whole game is based on giving a maximum of 70% (I’m being kind)  to each and every single aspect of play. 

I have not disliked a player so much since Danny Fox’s display on our return to the Premier League, fortunately his tenure at that level only lasted a few months whereas Redmond has been faking it for 4/5 seasons - although it feels like 10.

If you watch him in isolation, Redmond often stands and ball watches- maybe he has a season ticket -when he should be making space to recieve a ball or staying with the man he is marking.

What I find incredible is that his Managers and teammates let him get away with his lack of effort and ability whilst also putting up with him moaning at them. A good Captain would have sorted, or more likely shifted, him ages ago, unfortunately Saints just haven’t had that leader since he’s been with us.

 

 

[Lord Duckhunter]

5 minutes ago, Saintelsewhere said:

I think the best way to describe his football is:  Cowardly.

His whole game is based on giving a maximum of 70% (I’m being kind)  to each and every single aspect of play. 

I have not disliked a player so much since Danny Fox’s display on our return to the Premier League, fortunately his tenure at that level only lasted a few months whereas Redmond has been faking it for 4/5 seasons - although it feels like 10.

If you watch him in isolation, Redmond often stands and ball watches- maybe he has a season ticket -when he should be making space to recieve a ball or staying with the man he is marking.

What I find incredible is that his Managers and teammates let him get away with his lack of effort and ability whilst also putting up with him moaning at them. A good Captain would have sorted, or more likely shifted, him ages ago, unfortunately Saints just haven’t had that leader since he’s been with us.

 

 

Do you really believe Claude Puel, Mark Hughes and Pelligrino, all combative players, plus the present manager (who I don’t know what was like as a player), let a player get away with “faking it”? Do you believe that all his team mates for the past few years have let him stand around “watching like he’s got a season ticket”.
 

Of course they don’t, you’re writing pony.